Lace A Valley

 
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Old 11-22-2009, 09:04 PM   #1
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Lace A Valley


I am shingling a house and I always lace my valleys. The problem with this roof is to the left of the valley is a 4/12 slope and to the right of the valley is a 6/12 slope. If I were to lace it like a normal roof when I get to the top the shingles will cross a foot from the valley.

Any recremendations?

I was thinking about when the shingles start to run off running two shingles on the same side then lacing the other side to bring them back in the valley.
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Old 11-23-2009, 05:45 AM   #2
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Re: Lace A Valley


An extra shingle ran through as needed to keep them crossing in the valley is all you need to do.

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Old 11-23-2009, 08:55 AM   #3
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Re: Lace A Valley


I did a woven valley in a similar set up.

The end result is OK but if you like all your lines in a row it might bug you.

My valley is nice and water tight but looks a little odd.
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Old 11-23-2009, 01:25 PM   #4
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Re: Lace A Valley


you are not really supposed to install dimensional shingles like that, are you?
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Old 11-23-2009, 06:14 PM   #5
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Re: Lace A Valley


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you are not really supposed to install dimensional shingles like that, are you?
Nope, but guys do and actually think there will be no problems with it in the future. (Assuming they live in an area with snow and rain.)
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Old 11-24-2009, 06:29 AM   #6
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Re: Lace A Valley


We stopped weaving valley's in the early 90's because we all agreed water runs down a cut valley quicker than a weaved valley.
Faster run off equals less debris build up and a longer time frame before the shingles begin to curl up.
It had nothing to do with them leaking, if you weave a valley and it leaks than you screwed up, just like if your cut valley leaks.

I have dozens of weaved dimensional and 3-tab shingle valleys that are over 15 years old and still holding up.
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Old 11-24-2009, 07:08 AM   #7
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Re: Lace A Valley


I did my woven valley 7 years ago and it doesn't really build up with Debris.

It is North East Facing.

When I did it there was an article in Fine Home Building stating that it was the strongest valley.

My home is under construction and we went with my roofers suggestion of the Metal w valley. They look so much better.

My roofer said, and I love this "Who did you hire to roof the garage?" I replied "I did it myself." He replied "I'll do this roof for you on one condition - you never roof another job"

Love it.


On my defence it was my first roof.
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Old 11-24-2009, 08:23 AM   #8
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Re: Lace A Valley


I have never done a woven or cut valley for two reasons. The first being I think it looks less finished than then a W metal valley. The second is that roofs who seem to have those types of valleys around here fail faster than those without. Maybe it is because of the huge differences in temperature, the snow just sitting on it for months or improperly installed. I really don't know.
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Old 11-24-2009, 08:47 AM   #9
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Re: Lace A Valley


The conventional woven valley would be for you to determine the sequence of an occasional double row to bring the weave back to center.

Otherwise you will go off as you have discovered.
Some contractors I have seen lay one side first and then overlay a cut valley with sealant under that layer however the repairs I do for leaky valleys seems to be predominantly cut valleys overlapped in that manner.

I have only two choices in valleys to my liking, woven straight or metal. However in the past I have done what I would call a skip weave where you weave a few rows, do a double and then weave again at a consistent interval to keep it as visually appealing as you can.
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Old 11-25-2009, 07:18 AM   #10
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Re: Lace A Valley


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Originally Posted by JohnFRWhipple View Post
I did my woven valley 7 years ago and it doesn't really build up with Debris.

It is North East Facing.

When I did it there was an article in Fine Home Building stating that it was the strongest valley.

My home is under construction and we went with my roofers suggestion of the Metal w valley. They look so much better.

My roofer said, and I love this "Who did you hire to roof the garage?" I replied "I did it myself." He replied "I'll do this roof for you on one condition - you never roof another job"

Love it.


On my defence it was my first roof.

I agree with your roofer, open cut valleys is the best way to go when there properly installed, not many home owners are willing to pay the additional cost here in my area tho.
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Old 11-25-2009, 07:43 AM   #11
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Re: Lace A Valley


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Originally Posted by BamBamm5144 View Post
I have never done a woven or cut valley for two reasons. The first being I think it looks less finished than then a W metal valley. The second is that roofs who seem to have those types of valleys around here fail faster than those without. Maybe it is because of the huge differences in temperature, the snow just sitting on it for months or improperly installed. I really don't know.

The weather conditions with out a doubt make a difference,
but so doe's workmanship used during installation.

I just tore out a 6 year old open cut valley with W metal last year on a repair in Canfield, Ohio.
Metal was properly installed, nice and straight with good lapping, etc.
Than they installed the shingles and had shingle fasteners as close as 1" of the cut on both sides.

No styles, brand names or procedures are bullet proof, because the quality of how they hold up depends on the quality of workmanship used to install them.
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Old 11-25-2009, 07:52 AM   #12
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Re: Lace A Valley


Slyfox, I just did an inspection on a 7 year old roof a few weeks back with an open metal valley. The install was so poorly done that there were actually nails in the exposed part of the valley. I mean, not two or three nails but around 8 and the dang thing never leaked I was told.

Truth be told, I feel like any brand, any shingle, any system can and will work for years if installed properly. I find 98% of the time that early failure in a roofing system is due to installer error either from improper ventilation or nailing patterns. The only time I can really think of it being a manufacturer error are the organic shingles on the condos we have been working on since they were installed correctly with proper ventilation.

A proper roofing system is not as easy as putting some nails anywhere you would like into a shingle as majority of roofers seem to think.
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Old 11-26-2009, 06:21 AM   #13
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Re: Lace A Valley


[quote=BamBamm5144;815370]Slyfox, I just did an inspection on a 7 year old roof a few weeks back with an open metal valley. The install was so poorly done that there were actually nails in the exposed part of the valley. I mean, not two or three nails but around 8 and the dang thing never leaked I was told.

How some leaks don't show up inside the home still amazes me sometimes.

The re-roof we did the week before last had a little over 80' of walls,
the last roofers "22 years ago" installed a starter shingle than placed their first 5x7 step flashing on top of it and than placed all the rest of the 5x7 steps one after another with roughly a 1" over lap on each and nailed them down, the ran their shingles simply laid over them instead of laced into them.

All 5 walls leaked, but, the leak built up at the bottom "eave' end and all tho it destroyed the overhangs it never leaked inside the home.

We even cored the walls under the leaks, exterior and interior, and found no rot on the wall studs/structure.
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Old 11-29-2009, 03:54 PM   #14
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Re: Lace A Valley


We just inspected a 5 year old roof counted over 200 exposed or backing out nails,which were just high nails and are coming thru.On a low slope area on the back the shingles were racked 1 and 2 inches apart, no steps and flashing on any of the gabled eaves.The seller told the buyer his son roofed it and then told her they wernt dropping price and to move on.

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