Inexperienced H/o Seeks Advice On Estimates

DMM

A roofer just left my home after giving an estimate for all attached homes (5). The estimate, is for 29 sq shingles, 5 sq capping, 5 year labor warranty, then it says 35 year (which I am assuming is the shingle warranty). The estimate reads, :Tear off all old shingles, replace any bad wood, clean yard when job is done, rige vent. (does he mean 'ridge vent?)'

My neighbor was handed the estimate and I didn't have the chance to speak with the roofers before they left except to ask what brand shingles. They said architectural and I again said, "No, what brand?" They repeated that so I imagine Architectural is a brand. All I got a chance to ask is "nail or staple?" (nail, 6 per shingle) and I asked if they were master roofers, certified, bonded, insured. They said yes.

I have no problem with going in with neighbors getting a new roof but because I am a woman I am having a hard time getting the other homeowners (men) to listen to my concerns which are as follows:

The estimate does not specify which brand of shingles.
It does not say they will be nailing and not stapling.
Are they prepared to show their credentials?
No mention is made, in writing, of a moisture barrier (we're in the SE)

I would appreciate it if a professional could please assist me in what questions to ask. My concern is that the price is lower than I have ever heard for all this work. What if he takes off the shingles and the roof is rotted? He's replacing all the wood? That could cost him much more money than he anticipated. I am not saying I want to pay more than he quoted but I am saying that the men are so excited about the low price that they are not asking any questions.

Also, is a roof in the SE (the Carolinas) replaced in a different manner than in the NE? It seems to me if the climate is different then the roofing codes would be different since we're in a wind and hail area.

Am I being too pushy with the other neighbors in wanting to SEE the insurance papers and bonding papers and have all the things they said they would do IN WRITING for the protection of the homeowners and of the roofer? Are there important things I should ask that I am forgetting?

Thank you very much for your help. If I am being a pain to the roofers and just being overly cautious please tell me.

Glasshousebltr

It's good to be cautious, but don't the fella to the point of not wanting the job, we all shy away from the problem customers.

Check his references, that's what should count. Maybe even go look at one.

Bob

__________________
Bob

noreast05

Sounds like there rushing around from job to job. A roof is a big expense. They should take the time to talk to you. Show examples or give references. With a five year warranty you would like to feel confident they will be around in five years. Call some other companies to get some better understanding of the price. Don't neccesarily go with the lowest bidder. They may low ball it and the tell you need all sorts of stuff for alot more money. Yes it should be ridge vent. And usually any rotted deck boards will be replaced not all unless all are needed. Of course this would be an extra charge. Becareful you may not know if any or all were replaced until you get a big bill at the end of the job. Of course there is no way to tell what boards need attention until the old roofing is off. I like to walk all my clients through the whole process. I want them to know what they can expect. I give them a best and worst case scenario. I have built alot of trust with my clients. I would not even consider giving them a low bid and then stiff them with a big bill. I (my company) plans on being around in 5, 10, 15 plus years.

Hope my long winded post helps a bit

Good luck


P.S. When comparing to other companies make sure you compare apples to apples!

Glasshousebltr

Why don't you tell us what he's charging?

What pitch is your roof, can you walk it?

If you can walk it and he's below or near 3500, his crew with their families may all live in the same single bed house and not answer the door when a Gov. vehicle pulls up.

Bob

__________________
Bob

noreast05

You read my mind

K2

Are permits, licenses, inspections required. any complaints against this company?? Check with your local building dept.

Glasshousebltr

Most states wont let the building dept get involved in customer complaints. About all I 've seen a building dept do is confirm local biz license and permit.

Bob

__________________
Bob

DMM

I'm sorry, I thought I wasn't permitted to speak about price. I have no idea what the pitch of the roof is but it isn't flat and yes, you could walk it (carefully anyway). It's a typical townhouse roof, like a little kid would draw when drawing a house, up one side, down the other. Sorry, no one is here to tell me the pitch, best I can describe it.

He quoted a price of $4500.00 for all five homes, $900.00 each, which is about $155.00 a square as we have 29 squares. He states this INCLUDES ripping off any rotted wood and replacing it. In the event the other three homes do not want theirs done he will do mine and my neighbor's for $1200.00each. (Our roofs are the only ones connected and to do one without the other would look terrible. )The reason, he said, is because he has five jobs all in the same place and doesn't have to move equipment etc. Thus, a lower price for all five homes.

My elderly neighbor who's lived here for years says that the company has been here for years. I will check references etc but I don't know what I am supposed to ask regarding shingles etc. I know there are shingles roofers consider junk and I would prefer to pay more to get a decent shingle.

I am trying my best not to be a pain in the butt to them and that's why I am asking you how much should I ask of them. I don't want to insult anyone. I don't want DNA and fingerprints but I would like to see some of their final product.

By the way, is 'architectural' a brand of shingle? Thanks very much. DMM

Glasshousebltr

It's a style of shingle, a good style if I might add.

I think 4500 is low, but very fair, for a townhouse set up. Same roll away, same cleanup, same color etc.

If he didn't plan on new flash, pay for yours and tell him to install it. New flash is important and some try to get around it.

Bob

__________________
Bob

noreast05

That would be a style of the shingles. Some roofers have prefrences on the brand they use. Some are certified through these different companies ...hence their perference.

It never hurts to ask questions. It does make sense to to use the same company. But it doesn't hurt to check with others to compare........remember apple's to apple's

noreast05

I agree with Bob 4500 seems low, perhaps that's your market. I hope the cost of living is cheaper down there than it is here.

Grumpy

DMM, where are you located? Did you get more than one quote? If you got more than one quote why do you prefer this roofer above the others?

Like glass said it's good to be cautious, but not overly cautious.

The thing is this seems like a "on the spot" written proposal which isn't very clear as to what exactly is to be done. This protects me, the roof, as well as it protects you, the buyer. Here is a little cut and paste of my proposal template:

Ask these questions:
What type and brand of shingles? (QArchitectural is a type)
How many nails per shingle?
What type of felt?
Will flashings be replaced?
Where will you be installing ice shield?
Can I see your insurance, both workmans compensation and general liability?
Is a state roofing license required? If so can I see yours?
Who gets the permit? Is it an extra cost?

Read this: http://www.diyrepair.com/home-improv...a-shingle.html also read this http://www.diyrepair.com/home-improv...ontractor.html and thank me later.

Glasshousebltr

Grump, I don't buy into that state license garbage. When the Dept of Professional Regulation decides to use it's powers to regulate workmanship instead of extort funds, maybe then. Until then all they seem to be is another bill.

Bob

__________________
Bob

DMM

A thank you to all who replied. We are located in Surfside Beach, SC and yes, the cost of living is much cheaper than up North.

Mr. Grumpy, you hit the nail on the head with my concerns. Nothing concerned me more than this quick price, spotty contract with no details and them asking us to sign immediately. This is the first estimate, we will have two more coming and yes, we will compare apples to apples. However, I can't do that without knowing exactly what each company is going to do.

When I was in the workforce and we sent out a request for proposal the companies would come back to us with a contract very similar to yours, i.e., we will do such and such, we will use such and such. I am kind of used to that type of contract which protects both the consumer and the contractor.

I asked twice what BRAND of shingle; they answered architectural. I said, "No, what BRAND?" and the neighbors, annoyed with me, said to me, "He SAID architectural!" I thought that was a type, as you stated, not a brand. I was looking for an answer like Certainteed etc etc. Not that I know what shingle is best, just would like to know what they are using.

I also asked the neighbors getting the estimate the questions you listed and they didn't know the answers. Thus, my concern. I didn't ask about ice shield. Do we need ice shield in South Carolina and what is it? I did ask about a moisture barrier and was told they would do that but not told what kind. Also asked who was responsible for getting the permits and the neighbors didn't know that either.

I do NOT want to step on anyone's toes, I like my neighbors and would love to just allow them to take over and me not worry about the job BUT, and this is a big but, for me this is a lot of money and I want to make sure I know what I'm getting. I want to be as fair to the roofer as I would like him to be fair to me. That's all I ask.

Thank you all for your input and I will read your link you sent Mr. Grumpy. I appreciate all the help. DMM

paroofer

If someone really thinks that architectural is a BRAND.....I would be concerned that he is a hack and RUN THE OTHER WAY!!!!!
All of your questions should be answered without hesitation, anyway.


Just my .02

red_cedar

It is a simple thing. If you are unsure what is involved and it is not specified in the estimate, ask for clarification. If you are considering this particular contractor then get the clarification in writing. Only sign when you feel you understand.

DMM

Thanks Joanna. I see you get my point. They certainly know what BRAND of shingles they use, they just didn't appreciate my interjection with questions such as staples or nails, reroof or pull off the old, certified, insured, workman's comp? They were dealing with the men and I guess they figured that I didn't know what I was talking about so didn't want to waste time on me. They are right, I don't know what I'm talking about. But, this is MY house. That's why this site is such a wonderful help.

A few years ago I was almost ripped off, big time, by an HVAC company and the men on that HVAC internet site, while my ac was being installed, walked me through what to ask, what to check and what to say. They saved me a fortune and also prevented a bait and switch TWICE! I paid for one unit and they brought me the wrong unit two times. Finally they told me mine wasn't in stock so I told them (with the advice of the HVAC men) to bring me the better unit and they didn't charge me for it.

I would prefer to trust everyone but my dad always told me to 'trust in God but tie my camel." I'm just tying my camel. Thanks for the help. DMM

DMM

Thank you so much! I knew what I needed but didn't know how to go about asking without insulting anyone. CLARIFICATION! You're a genius. The word is non combative, I am saying I don't understand and only asking for an explanation. So, who could argue with that? You are totally correct and have solved my problem and yes, you are right:

Down to its common denominator all I really want is clarification. Simple.

Thank you very much and that will be the operative word in all my future dealings.

noreast05

Ice and Water shield. It's a rubber membrane that is self adhesive on one side. It's 3feet wide. It's used in valleys along the eves, around chimneys and soil stacks, stink pipes, (plumbing vents protruding through the roof). I think everyone needs it. Especially along the coast. It's not a product for just us in the northeast. Or any other lucky ones with frigid temps.

Glasshousebltr

See DMM, if it was I giving your estimate, and you began question me about product and application, I would have told you how spectacularly beautiful you looked today.

Then maybe a great dress comment.

Bob

__________________
Bob