Getting Sued For Possible Bird Defect

Bob-44

Hello to all fellow roofers!
I have been roofing for 23 years and last week I got my first threat of a lawsuit. A Woodscape shingle roof installed in 1992.
Customer already tore off and had roof re-done, now wants to sue me.
Other roofer told him I did it all wrong becasue I ran the tar paper at a 45 degree angel. Also, they claim 1 1/4" nails were not correct.
Bird recalled these shingles and the buckeling after 15 years most likely occured from that, but now we have no evidence.
I need to defend my installation.
Does anyone have time to look at the pics via email?

Thanks so much!
Bob
matrix42@sover.net

Ed the Roofer

Statute of Limitations. What is it in your state? It probably has long ago elapsed.

That was 15 years ago for goodness sake. Just get a free consultation with your attorney and he will probably advise you to either ignore the unmeritous complaint or to tell the 15 years ago customer to pound sand.

Ed

Bob-44

Thank you , Ed, for your super fast reply.
Here's the kicker. This customer also happens to be a litigation lawyer! He says the statue starts running when you notice the problem. We have consulted our own lawyer, but we can see the dollar signs adding up not that she has responded to his complaint. He will pay no money to fight and fight, we will.
What I was also hoping is your thoughts on 1 1/4" nails and running paper on an angle. I have benn taught by the best German roofer (Lutz) from New Jersey. I have never had a problem, but this other roofer has filled this guys head with all ideas that I have no idea how to install a roof.
Also, he says some shingles only had 3 nails, not 4.
I had a crew with me, so I cant be 100% sure on that. But he wants $13,000 !
Bob

Ed the Roofer

1 1/4" nails would be spec for a first or even a second layer roof. Find a supplier who has some old Bird paperwork laying around.

I think? Bird was taken over by Certainteed? Call Certainteed and see if they have records for Bird installation specifications.

Did the othe roofer or homeowner take photos of the alleged discrepencies? Do you have any photos?

Or is it just word of mouth?

Consult for free with your own lawyer first to see where you stand.

Did the roof leak? If he says so, were you ever notified? Was it by certified letter or just a supposed phone call?

Why did you or do you still install felt paper on an angle versus parallel to the eave edge? No specification I have ever seenand read suggested that.

Did this homeowner receive the benefit of a leak proof roof for the past 15 years. I don't get it, so you better get a free consultation to see where you stand legally.

Ed

skyhook

Back stabbing contractor Lawyers threaten but seldom act. Try the frivilous lawsuit defense. From what you said about 3 nails vs 4, the other roofer is clueless. S of L on work in Ca. is 5 years. Fight the SOB.

__________________

tinner666

What does the felt have to do with the roof? That's a question! If the roof was installed correctly, felt was unnecessary in the first place. HGTV and Bob Villa have often showcased roofs going on without ANY underlay. SO it's a moot point. IMHO

I've done it often when I ran short. Quit though when fiberglass shingles became mainstream.

But it should be installed paralell with the eaves, in just for reference lines that can let you know EARLY if something is off somewhere.

The rest of it sounds like smoke and BS. Like Ed said, find some info on your own, etc. Heck you can even print from these forums if any answers seem relevant.

Bob-44

Yes, I have some pics. I can try to post them here, or can I email them to you, Ed?
My lawyer says settle with him for a few thousand before legal fees mount up. Also, says that our insurance really should help out, but our insurance (Natulis) says they wont back us because the claim in alleged "improper installation". We pay 5K per year for lialibility! For what?
Lawyer says we can and should get affidavits from other roofers saying that the installition process was acceptable.
As far as running paper like that, I was taught that way and it has never given me a problem, but now I guess I've learned to go by the book.
NO Leaks at all, not one call until a letter from this guy who is a big shot lawyer. He just said he noticed the roof looking "Odd" after 15 years.
Also was told that the plywood now shows "early signs of Delamination" because the shingles were buckeling and moisture got in.
He really got an ear full from this other roofer.
I just dont get why this is the first complaint in 23 years.
I do 99% slate now and I am GLAD!
let me know on the pics.
Bob
(thx, skyhook, too)

Ed the Roofer

Just post the photos so everyone can comment on them.

Also, felt paper may not have been required, just suggested, so that is why you need to check out the manufacturers original specifications from way back in 1992. Check out your old building code requirements too. If it does not say anything to the contrary, at least you have some leverage on your behalf.

I would not pay him anything and just call his bluff. If you do choose to make an offer, make it prorated based on either your original warranty length terms or the manufacturers length and only for the remaining prorated amount for materials only based on the costs of the materials from 1992, just like the manufacturers warranties state. Have you attorney draw up a release of any additional liabilities for you.

Also, the insurance company you have can not just assume from the homeowners implication that this is an installation only issue. They have a legally implied duty to serve their client. Ask your attorney about this also.

If you want to take a proper legal avenue, subpoena the other roofing contractor and proceed with a Discovery motion at ascertain his actual comments and not just those homeowner interpretations of his comments.

I have heard of legal issues regarding improper ventilation specifications being an issue after the implied statute of limitations has supposedly expired.

You can do a google search on law cases regarding roofing issues after statute of limitations have theoretically expired to gain additional insight.

Ed

Bob-44

Hi All,
I have the pics as a pdf attachment to an email. I can't (for the life of me) get them from the email to this forum. Is anyone smart enough to do this if I email directly to you?

I am printing all of your thoughts out. And I really do appreciate all this imput (dont be afraid to be honest)

Bob

Ed the Roofer

The instructions are either in the faq section, or you can do a search for it.

I have never done it, so I can not hep, but I do remember reading the instructions on how to do it.

Or, you can post a question in the "site help and suggestions" forum down below. That is probably where the instructions are posted anyway.

Ed

Ed the Roofer

Yes, it was in there. Here are the instructions compliments of ProWallGuy, who took the time to post a sticky there.

Ed

How to attach a photo to a post
All right boys and girls, follow these instructions to attach a photo, word document, excel spreadsheet, zip file, etc. to a post.

EDIT: To attach an excel spreadsheet, you must put it in a zip file first.

First thing to do is find the attachment on your pc, and make a note of where it is located. I prefer to put attachments in a folder on my desktop. The folder is called 'uploadpics'. This makes it easy for me to find. All attachments must be 100kb or smaller in size. The following chart shows what type of attachments will work.
Attached Images

__________________

RooferJim

You can call Bird warranty hotline at 1-800-247-3047 they were bought out by Certainteed but still make good on the claims. You should not be on the hook for a 15 year old roof that is assinine. fight them tooth and nail dont settle. Lawyers suck

RooferJim

Bob-44

trying to do what you said, but I dont see the pic. I'll keep trying

Ron The Plumber

E-mail them to me I'll post them for you, send PM so you can get my e-mail.

Ed the Roofer

I think he needs 20 posts before he can pm anyone here.

Ed

Ron The Plumber

Mods...........

Please remove this post it's not needed anymore.

Bob-44

Well, I managed to send some pics to Ron.
Thank you all very much!
I am in Vermont, hope someday I can re-pay you all for even considering all this

Bob

Ron The Plumber

Got em, I'll size them done and get them up on here, give me some time, right now I have to head back to work, a couple of hours.

Ron The Plumber

Roof Pictures

Here is three will upload one more.

Attached Thumbnails

     

Ron The Plumber

Last picture

Attached Thumbnails