Taking over a mess - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

strathd · 02-01-2009, 12:27 PM

I took over a remodel job for a women that has a real mess. This is the worst work I have ever seen. She hired this guy to make livable space out of her attic. He tore off the back roof and put a flat roof on with a rubber roof over it. 8' walls underneath. The windows dont even have headers above them, just a flat 2x4 around the window. No trimmers/jacks, nothing. One window doesnt even have a sill plate just cripple studs up to the bottom of the window. Another window has no framing around it at all just a hole in the osb, window set in. On top of all that none of the windows are the same height ! Then he vinyl sided it. The HO is doing the job in phases, the shell was the first phase. He told her it was done. She paid him. Guess she did'nt know any better. After friends and family walked through she found out what a mess she had. This is an older house with native lumber and plaster walls and ceilings. This is where I come in. The original guy had planned on sistering 2x6's to the native lumber ceiling joist to get it flat for the sub floor. After walking around on the cj's I decided it was just too spongy for that. They span 14'. So I built a 2x10 floor above the ceiling joist. Which resulted in a loss of headroom but I didnt see any other alternative. Now here's the problem. The roof spans 28' front to back. It's not even a 1/12 maybe a 3/4"/12 have'nt checked it yet. He used 2x6 rafters on 16" centers with a double 2x8 for a beam down the center. The space is 30' wide. He did at least put a temporary post in the middle of the beam LOL. So I have 2x6 rafters spanning 14' on a flat roof. Besides being way to spongy I cant get r-30 insulation in a 5 1/2" space unless there's some new type of insulation that I dont know about. Thought about sistering 2x10's beside the 2x6's and putting an lvl in for the beam but I hate to lose anymore headroom on the low end. Anybody have any ideas ? Doubling the 2x6's ? Tripling ? Three years ago I would have ran away from this job but these days i'm taking anything I can get. I'll try to post pics tommorow night you guys wont believe how bad the workmanship is on this job. Thanks

Aggie67 · 02-01-2009, 01:18 PM

I'd ask how the inspector passed any of it, but my guess is the original contractor talked her out of that process.

It is a mess, you have there. But this is also an opportunity to save the project and come out shining. I've been involved in a few of these rescues the last 18 months. This is how I manage the process:

1. Stay in constant comm with the homeowner. Hopefully you're a people person. Be honest, and be sincere. If the answer to her question is "this is a real mess, I can help you, but we're going to have to involve an engineer to see if we can salvage this beam, and involve the permit process", then be honest and say that. And be pro-active with the town. Ask the homeowner permission to call the town on her behalf. If she says no, I'd personally back away from the project for liability reasons. I read that you already started some work. I hope you pulled a permit, otherwise now your hide is tagged to the workmanship, just as thoroughly as the first guy's.

2. When you first call the town, say "hi, I got a call from a resident that kind of got snookered by a contractor, and she wants me to come fix it properly. Before I commit to this, do you have time to stop by and walk through it? I can show you what went in and the plan I have to rescue the project. And I have to tell you up front, it looks like the first guy talked her out of pulling a permit, apparently, and now she's terrified, so she could use some reassuring words that this is the best path to take." I'm batting a thousand when I approach a town in this fashion.

3. Once the town is involved, they'll want the work to stop until a set of plans have been approved and a permit has been issued. It might delay you, but it's the right way to do it. This is where you can shine, by being honest and saying "if I were anything less than a professional, I'd slap a fix in without the permit, and I'd have some work for a little bit and put some food on my table. But I'd rather do it right and involve the right parties, that way you and your insurance company know at a minimum that it's up to code, even if it means I go hungry for a week or two." And you never know, she might have some painting she needs done in the meantime (or knows someone who does).

After that, it's like a normal project. As for your specific questions, in most of the cases where I came in and helped, it involved my sealed drawings and permits, and a local contractor. In two cases the homeowners DIY'd the rest of the work themselves, with permits.

strathd · 02-01-2009, 01:36 PM

Thanks for the reply aggy. Where I live the only inspection we have is plumbing. Thats it nothing else. You could build a house out of toothpicks and nothing would be said. Plumbers are the only trade that has to be licensed. GC's dont even have to be licensed. As a result we have a lot of "briefcase builders" (guys with cash flow and no knowledge). A lot of us wish we had licensing and inspections. It would weed out the briefcase guys and hacks.

SelfContract · 02-01-2009, 01:44 PM

..and make sure she still have money$ to pay you or have daily jobs, or any home equity from bank loans she can borrow, etc... and also take 50-75% deposit before commit job.. You don't want she to run away, or file bankruptcy, or sue back or else, etc..

In this bad economy, it's hard to believe anyone at all, even believe in Mr. president Obama's stimuus promises, etc... Good luck!

wallmaxx · 02-01-2009, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by strathd

Where I live the only inspection we have is plumbing. Thats it nothing else. You could build a house out of toothpicks and nothing would be said.

Wow.

If no city or county inspection / regulation system is in place....being in our trade(s) in your neck o' the woods must be rough.

You are competing against any crack whore with a hammer. And with no inspections...his work is as good as yours or mine. Its all relative...and only the HO is the judge. I would hate that.

We charge high and get it here, compared to the rest of the nation, because of all the inspection and code requirements. Simpson and all their metal fasteners are KING here. I hope NW Ohio gets some regulations and enforcement soon...for all you legit contractor's sake.

TempestV · 02-01-2009, 05:48 PM

as far as the insulation question, provided that the span could be done right by adding more 2x6, could you add foam insulation on the top of the roof? I worked on a roof done this way recently- we put 2x4 sleepers down on the flat, perpendicular to the joists, 2' on center, then cut strips of 1.5" blue foam to fit between them, then used the sleepers for nailers when sheathing.

strathd · 02-01-2009, 06:33 PM

Thanks for the reply tempest. This place is allready sided though. Rubber roof, fascia, etc. Guess i'm grasping at straws here but I know the HO is on a llimited budget. I have done similar things to what you suggested on two log homes that I have built.