Sheathing walls on ground....... - Page 3 - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

crovello · 10-25-2009, 06:49 PM

I have been sheathing walls before standing them for 25 years. This is all changing with the new codes in high wind areas. The Simpson HDU hold downs are much easier to install without sheathing in place.

Dave

**loneframer** · 10-25-2009, 07:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crovello

I have been sheathing walls before standing them for 25 years. This is all changing with the new codes in high wind areas. The Simpson HDU hold downs are much easier to install without sheathing in place.

Dave

The towns I do much of my work in require a Simpson strap on every stud, tied into box on the first floor and every other stud at the second floor with a minimum 1' tie in to first and second floor studs nailed with 10D commons at every other hole through the sheathing. They used to allow us to eliminate the straps if the plywood crossed the box by at least one foot both ways.
I've tried several different ways to achieve the end goal and sheathing the walls after standing works best for me. Ladders are not convenient on a 3 story building with 4' setbacks, so pump jacks are the only way to fly.

wellbuilthome · 10-25-2009, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kgmz

We sheath almost all walls on the floor and the sheathing is long to cover the rim, except for garage walls.

Here is how we keep it from sliding, been doing this for 30 years. We toe nail from the inside of wall through the bottom plate at a 45 degree angle. The nail will come out into the floor right at the corner of bottom plate at the floor, right on the chalk line. This way the wall will not slide and when you tip it up it is already locked to the line. And you don't have to remove the nails afterward.

Kind of hard to explain. I'll draw a quick pic of it.

Same here , 12Ds toe nailed thru plate into chalk line .
We start sheathing at the bottom of the plate and scrap in the box beam with junk .
We leave a space for the box beem to shrink so the siding dosent buckel .

A W Smith · 10-25-2009, 07:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by loneframer

The towns I do much of my work in require a Simpson strap on every stud, tied into box on the first floor and every other stud at the second floor with a minimum 1' tie in to first and second floor studs nailed with 10D commons at every other hole through the sheathing. They used to allow us to eliminate the straps if the plywood crossed the box by at least one foot both ways.
I've tried several different ways to achieve the end goal and sheathing the walls after standing works best for me. Ladders are not convenient on a 3 story building with 4' setbacks, so pump jacks are the only way to fly.

I did some work in Jackson NJ. What a PITA with all that hardware. I believe Simpson is writing the code nowadays with all the hardware their inventing being legislated into use. Nothing like that up central and north Jersey. just started a garage in Old Bridge that was approved with nothing more than Simpson mab23 anchors.. In Jackson I had to have the headers wrapped to the top plate with Simpson straps. Fully blocked sheathing at the corners, and huge hold down brackets bolted to the studs with 5/8 inch foundation anchor J bolts not more that 1 foot from the corners.

cbfx3 · 10-25-2009, 07:43 PM

Very seldom do I sheet before standing.

Warren · 10-25-2009, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wellbuilthome

Same here , 12Ds toe nailed thru plate into chalk line .
We start sheathing at the bottom of the plate and scrap in the box beam with junk .
We leave a space for the box beem to shrink so the siding dosent buckel .

Around here, piecing in this way will not fly. The plywood over the band is intended to to help anchor the walls to the floor system. we are not allowed to splice the plywood at the bottom plate. It must be at least 12 inches away. We usually will install a full sheet even with the top plate for 9 ft walls, stand the wall and add the final piece after the wall is up. You figure somebody has too staple off the tyvek anyway, so they can install that plywood while they are set up there.

**loneframer** · 10-25-2009, 08:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by A W Smith

I did some work in Jackson NJ. What a PITA with all that hardware. I believe Simpson is writing the code nowadays with all the hardware their inventing being legislated into use. Nothing like that up central and north Jersey. just started a garage in Old Bridge that was approved with nothing more than Simpson mab23 anchors.. In Jackson I had to have the headers wrapped to the top plate with Simpson straps. Fully blocked sheathing at the corners, and huge hold down brackets bolted to the studs with 5/8 inch foundation anchor J bolts not more that 1 foot from the corners.

The last wood framed house we did was in Cape May Court House(it's a town, not a building).Foundation bolts tied to rebar in the footings, sill plate tied to joist box with Simpson truss plates, walls tied to floor framing with straps, rafters tied down with over the top rafter ties, rafters tied to the ridge beam with joist hangers....

Thousands of dollars in hardware and labor.

Timuhler · 10-25-2009, 08:33 PM

You guys want to see hardware, check out this link This is the carp I took the eyebrow class with.

Very cool to watch the progress

Lubs · 10-25-2009, 09:21 PM

We do it the same as most of you here. Sheet on the ground by nailing it to the chalk line then squaring it. We use a panel router bit that has a drill on the end and you plung it in the window and around you go. The guide is fixed not a bearing so when it gets dull it tends to burn the 2X. When building outside corners that the plywood overlaps we will hold our wall back at least the width of the 2x and sheet. We will then raise the wall and pull our nails. We then pound a crow bar under the plate and walk the wall into position. If it is a short wall you can just slide it. We also use wall jacks on large walls. Two guys can stand a 50' wall no problem.

scottalan · 10-26-2009, 05:22 PM

Guys it went pretty smoothly today it's a little more work but I think it will be worth it. Thanks to every one who contributed to this thread.

crovello · 10-26-2009, 06:03 PM

Simpson HDU hold downs. The 5/8" threaded rod passes thru the floor framing and connects to a 5/8" anchor bolt with a coupling. These need to be connected to nearly every window openning on this project so the foundation crew needs to place many anchor bolts in exact locations. The other option is to set anchors in place with epoxy later. I am still not sure what method workes best. Trying to get my foundation crew to place anchor bolts to within a quarter inch is not easy.

This is why I did not sheath walls while laying down on this project.

Timuhler · 10-26-2009, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crovello

Attachment 24489Simpson HDU hold downs. The 5/8" threaded rod passes thru the floor framing and connects to a 5/8" anchor bolt with a coupling. These need to be connected to nearly every window openning on this project so the foundation crew needs to place many anchor bolts in exact locations. The other option is to set anchors in place with epoxy later. I am still not sure what method workes best. Trying to get my foundation crew to place anchor bolts to within a quarter inch is not easy.

This is why I did not sheath walls while laying down on this project.

Is a washer needed there? I didn't think it was required, just a nut tightend 1/2 to 1/3 turn past finger tight.

crovello · 10-26-2009, 06:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Timuhler

Is a washer needed there? I didn't think it was required, just a nut tightend 1/2 to 1/3 turn past finger tight.

To be honest, I am not sure if the nuts are required or not but the engeneer inspected them and did not complain that I used them.

The problem with using them is you have to leave room to install all the screws into the studs. This means you have to leave studs out in many locations to make this posible. Without all the studs in place I can't get all the required blocking in place. So now I stand the wall up, install HDU and missing studs, add blocking at every plywood joing and then apply sheathing. Much slower than my old method of wall framing.

Dave

Warren · 10-26-2009, 06:32 PM

We just used some of those for the first time. we used them on a garage and also an enclosed porch with large screened openings. Simpson charges a fortune for these things.

Framer53 · 10-26-2009, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warren

We just used some of those for the first time. we used them on a garage and also an enclosed porch with large screened openings. Simpson charges a fortune for these things.

Are you now a high wind zone? I didn't realize Ohio had them.

Timuhler · 10-26-2009, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crovello

To be honest, I am not sure if the nuts are required or not but the engeneer inspected them and did not complain that I used them.

The problem with using them is you have to leave room to install all the screws into the studs. This means you have to leave studs out in many locations to make this posible. Without all the studs in place I can't get all the required blocking in place. So now I stand the wall up, install HDU and missing studs, add blocking at every plywood joing and then apply sheathing. Much slower than my old method of wall framing.

Dave

What I've found is that I need enough room for a right angle drill + the screw length. In most cases we can sheathe later. What I do is cut a 1 1/2" or 2" hole in the bottom plates when I'm laying out so that all we have to do is add the all-thread later and put the HD's in.

If a stud is in the way, say it's 3" off the HD, then we just leave it out and sheathe the wall anyway and lift it. Later we add the stud and nail off the sheet. This way we dont have to handle sheets off ladders or set up scaffolding.

**loneframer** · 10-26-2009, 06:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Framer53

Are you now a high wind zone? I didn't realize Ohio had them.

My girl used to live in Ohio. She had to hit the cellar on more than one occasion due to tornado warnings.

Warren · 10-26-2009, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Framer53

Are you now a high wind zone? I didn't realize Ohio had them.

We get some wind but that wasnt the intention of those. They are really starting to enforce the shear wall details as written in the code and these framed walls had very little framing between the garage doors and the window openings at the porch. I think we used about 8 of them on the 3 car garage, and probably 10 or 12 on the porch. Same kind of detail like in those pics. 1 inch anchors had to be precisely place to align with king studs at doors and windows.

Framer53 · 10-26-2009, 07:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warren

We get some wind but that wasnt the intention of those. They are really starting to enforce the shear wall details as written in the code and these framed walls had very little framing between the garage doors and the window openings at the porch. I think we used about 8 of them on the 3 car garage, and probably 10 or 12 on the porch. Same kind of detail like in those pics. 1 inch anchors had to be precisely place to align with king studs at doors and windows.

Glad they aren't that picky around here!

Warren · 10-26-2009, 07:05 PM

I think it was more the architect than anything. We have had similar garages that didnt call for these. we usually run one continuous header and sheath the walls with plywood instead of osb. Architect also had us sheathe these walls with plywood using glue and lots of nails.