Roof Bracing Beam - Likes / Dislikes / ???

wallmaxx

Okay

I have already installed this beam / system to brace the hips and ridge from. So, now comes the fun.

In the collective professional opinions of the framing contractors here...is this an acceptable way to do this? Or am I whacked in the head?

Task: Brace the roof without deflecting the ceiling below.

Conditions: Use available materials on site plus 3 1/4" .131 HDG nails and glue in the confined space allotted.

Standard: System must manage the variable snow and other loads to a point WAY beyond code requirements...MY REQUIREMENTS.

I built the beam so that it clear spans the room and is braced mid span in such a way that it can not twist or roll under increased load. Both the middle and ends are laterally braced to prevent such roll.

I'm hanging it out there...dumb idea...good idea...is there a better way? I am always looking for a better way...kinda the carpentry holy grail.

Thanks

Mike

PS

The ellipses are the other thing I did today...nice to be somewhat "inside".

Attached Thumbnails

     

rbsremodeling

I do not see a reason for the beam.

If the hip roof was designed and installed correctly, I think the beam is overkill.

I also believe lumber needs to have some mobility to it and restricting that movement excessively leads to other problems. One of the best attributes of hip roofs is that it allows does not allow large loads snow/ice to sit undistributed in one area for long.

I am not a framer just thinking out loud as you are

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wallmaxx

Cool. That's what I'm looking for.

We all know that the hip part of a roof is more self supporting than the valley part. It's just that I have seen enough inspectors who require all hips, valleys and ridges be braced. In this situation, I had no place directly below the hips and this end of the ridge to brace to.

Keep the comments coming.

SNC

The hips are going to brace the ridge. If it were my house and I was worried about snow load I would run a 2x4 on edge, or better nail to togeather like a corner and run this perpendicular to the rafters midway between plate and ridge and then brace this every 10 feet or so down to a bearing wall or another pair of 2x4s down the center of your building on top of the ceiling joists.
The posts you show in your photo I feel dont do much good. If your rafters are tied in well with the walls and the c. joists or collar ties then the weakest point would be mid span in the rafters.

SNC

I can understand bracing a valley, but a hip, well all the jack rafters are doing just that.

rbsremodeling

That is my thought process as well.

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wallmaxx

All valid.

I have argued the self supporting nature of hip roofs with 2 or 3 inspectors........................................ ...and lost.

So, just to make sure that my roofs will pass, first-time-go, I brace EVERYTHING.

Mid span perpendicular bracing (purlin) good call...always. On 2x6 you have to about every 10' of run.

I'll upload a pic of that part of the roof with a wider angle view.

Burby

The hip & valley rafters have to be supported at the ridge down to a bearing point or a beam designed to carry & distribute the expected loads.

I'm surprised the plans did not have a bearing point to run down to or spec out a beam for you, as you built, to carry the roof load.
Here as well as all places now with the new IRC should be the same, any beams used for bearing needs to be approved by an Engineer to pass framing inspection. Some places push it more than others.
Here in SC plans won't even pass the planning board to pull the building permit, if missing any supports to bearing points or approved beams. Not so long ago Inspectors use to allow just the Ridge to be supported to a bearing point & the hips or valleys could pass by just being fastened to the ridge. Now each has to be supported.
All rafters, depending on the their spans have to be supported to a continuous bearing point or approved beam. No more just on top of c/j mid span as seen to many times prior. That is just good framing practice, wihout codes, to prevent roof loads being transferred to the ceilings below.



Have seen inspectors turn down framing if the plumb cut of the hip is more than the width of the ridge board. The ridge board has to be equal or greater than the plumb cut of the hips & valleys as it does with the rafters.

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KentWhitten

I think I understand what you're talking about. You really have nowhere to put a brace because there's no wall below. So you're trying your best option without causing deflection in the ceiling. I'm not sure if there's a good answer to your problem. Have you tried talking to the architect? It will fall on his responsibility. This is not yours to be responsible for.

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Timuhler

Mike,

A lot of our roofs now are engineered. I'll write on the roof plan how I want to frame it and the engineer will then do his work. Last summer though we had a house that had some monster hips (5 1/2" x 11 7/8" LVL upsized to 14" to hang below the ceiling). The customers wanted to take out the walls that defined the kitchen and have that room (kitchen, dining, rec room) open.

When I talked to the engineer, we had to add a post in front of the existing post to support the hips at the top. The other option would have been hardware to hold the hips at the ridge.

In most cases for us, he'll spec a strap that runs along the ridge and nails into the hips to support them. If we ever do that house again, we are thinking about having him design it so we don't have a post at all. That'd be interesting.

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wallmaxx

Thanks everyone.

SAcarpenter

Take this with a grain of salt as I don't know if I fully understand. The only thing I can think of is to get real crazy with some collar ties. Maybe criss crossing from plane to plane. Sorry thats all I got. On a side note, you seem to be the one here who has the most know how on hand framed roofs. I'm on a roof now that to say the least is humbling for me. when I get a little further I'll post some pics for you.

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wallmaxx

I have had to do this before to satisfy an inspection in Memphis.

I just like to hear what ways are out there that the men here have had to come up with to brace something over a space that can't be braced down on to.

In the old days, we'd run stiff back across the joists and brace down on it.

Mike

K2

I concur. There is no reason for carpenters to play engineer on complex roof systems. Even if you are capable and the next framer is capable, the third guy might not be capable. It can be dangerous and costly. It also could be 30, 40, 50 years before the world might find out that your engineering is inadequate.... If I was an inspector on the above roof i would have one word. "Stamp"