Non Load Bearing Walls, 10 Ft. High ?

 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-25-2011, 08:42 AM   #1
New Guy
 
HmBuilder2's Avatar
 
Trade: General Contractor
Join Date: Jun 2010
Posts: 21
Rewards Points: 10

Non Load Bearing Walls, 10 Ft. High ?


I have a friend who owns a grocery store, He wants to add 2 ofices on the sales floor so as to save on renting other office space.
He wants the overall area to be 14' X 56' X 10' with no ceiling, The finished space would be 2 offices 14X23
A total of 3 walls would be built as the other 2 walls are concrete exterior walls of the building. (Putting the offices in the corner of the sales floor) My question is how can the two 14' walls and the long 56' wall be secure so as not to wobble ?
HmBuilder2 is offline  

Warning: The topics covered on this site include activities in which there exists the potential for serious injury or death. ContractorTalk.com DOES NOT guarantee the accuracy or completeness of any information contained on this site. Always use proper safety precaution and reference reliable outside sources before attempting any construction or remodeling task!

   
 

Old 08-25-2011, 10:00 AM   #2
Registered User
 
C.StichCon's Avatar
 
Trade: General Contractor
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Southern California
Posts: 16
Rewards Points: 10

Re: Non Load Bearing Walls, 10 Ft. High ?


You would have to run 45 degree kickers up to the bottom of the roof joists. The amount of kickers required will depend on if you are framing with wood or metal studs. Option #2 would be to frame in a hard lid (ceiling). Option #3 would be to run posts in the framing all the way up to the joists to break wall span down (these would have to be solid members from floor to joist).
This should be specified in the plans.

Why no ceiling?
I understand if it is in the middle of the sales floor and you don't want to build up to the joists, and that you don't want wires for t-bar visible.
I am assuming the building is sprinklered, don't make the mistake of thinking by leaving the ceiling open that you won't have to move a few sprinkler heads around because wall placement and height will play into the coverage as well, but this would also be specified in the plans.

Since this is a commercial project, even adding non bearing walls will in most cases require a set of stamped plans. The city will not want the liability of approving any type of over the counter type permit due to public safety concerns dealing with fire safety. (At least in my experience this has been the case).

__________________
Stichler Construction
C.StichCon is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 10:19 AM   #3
Eater of sins.
 
ScipioAfricanus's Avatar
 
Trade: Designer/Drafter Extraordinaire
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Orange County, CA.
Posts: 2,314
Rewards Points: 1,450

Re: Non Load Bearing Walls, 10 Ft. High ?


Quote:
Originally Posted by C.StichCon View Post
You would have to run 45 degree kickers up to the bottom of the roof joists. The amount of kickers required will depend on if you are framing with wood or metal studs. Option #2 would be to frame in a hard lid (ceiling). Option #3 would be to run posts in the framing all the way up to the joists to break wall span down (these would have to be solid members from floor to joist).
This should be specified in the plans.

Why no ceiling?
I understand if it is in the middle of the sales floor and you don't want to build up to the joists, and that you don't want wires for t-bar visible.
I am assuming the building is sprinklered, don't make the mistake of thinking by leaving the ceiling open that you won't have to move a few sprinkler heads around because wall placement and height will play into the coverage as well, but this would also be specified in the plans.

Since this is a commercial project, even adding non bearing walls will in most cases require a set of stamped plans. The city will not want the liability of approving any type of over the counter type permit due to public safety concerns dealing with fire safety. (At least in my experience this has been the case).

That is very good advice.

Andy.
__________________
www.draftinginoc.com
ScipioAfricanus is online now  
Old 08-25-2011, 11:06 AM   #4
Pro
 
GettingBy's Avatar
 
Trade: Home Improvement/handyman
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DC area
Posts: 1,125
Rewards Points: 500

Re: Non Load Bearing Walls, 10 Ft. High ?


Are you allowed to drill holes in the floor to cantilever the wall uprights? Even a 1" dia. steel tube vertically in a hole is pretty strong.

I can't imagine these walls having to resist more than a 200 pound lateral force at 5' height so it's 1000 lb-ft of torque on the base of the cantilevered uprights, plus the downward force due to the weight per foot of the partitions.

How much lateral force in PSI can ordinary drywall resist, let's say with 16" O.C. studs? Can you push though it with your 8 sq. in. fist?
Let's say somebody rams the wall with a desk, 8 SF cross-sectional area, 30" high?

Last edited by GettingBy; 08-25-2011 at 11:49 AM.
GettingBy is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 12:22 PM   #5
I eat sawdust.
 
Winchester's Avatar
 
Trade: Deck Design/Build
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Posts: 3,975
Rewards Points: 2,000

Re: Non Load Bearing Walls, 10 Ft. High ?


no ceiling to save on lighting, venting, sprinklers, or whatever else may be required?

14' is not long, but 56' wall will need something, I would think. I would say to either tie it back horizontally to a solid wall or with the kickers like suggested above, whatever is easier/closer.


This ones was dang sturdy with just the stiffeners, but I think it was only 10x10 and two walls...



Last edited by Winchester; 08-25-2011 at 12:27 PM.
Winchester is offline  
Old 08-25-2011, 01:44 PM   #6
Pro
 
GettingBy's Avatar
 
Trade: Home Improvement/handyman
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: DC area
Posts: 1,125
Rewards Points: 500

Re: Non Load Bearing Walls, 10 Ft. High ?


To test your final product against a benchmark you need a storm door snubber spring, a rigid plate, a ruler, a string, a standard issue wall in your house and a scale.

Put the plate between the spring and the wall at 5' height or so over a stud, push horiz. on the spring and measure the wall deflection with a string and the spring deflection with a ruler. These stiff springs have a K factor of about 40 pounds per inch.

Record the wall deflection and the height.
Push the spring down against a scale until you get the same spring compression and read the pounds.

Compare your new wall compliance with your standard issue house wall compliance. Modify the new wall as needed.

Drywall mounted on the new wall prevents the studs from twisting so it adds to the stiffness.


Last edited by GettingBy; 08-25-2011 at 01:49 PM.
GettingBy is offline  


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Repainting interior block walls - Drylok? CarrPainting Painting & Finish Work 6 11-19-2010 04:55 PM
Load bearing beam and footers greendot Construction 18 06-19-2010 04:04 PM
removing load bearing wall question. auctionimage2 Construction 6 12-19-2008 12:41 PM
Load bearing walls EDT Framing 3 06-21-2006 06:20 PM
Load bearing wall pitterpat Framing 11 12-12-2005 05:11 PM

Join Now... It's Fast and FREE!

I am a professional contractor
I am a DIY Homeowner
Drywall Talk is for
PROFESSIONAL CONTRACTORS ONLY!

At DrywallTalk.com we cater exlusivly to professional contractors who make their living as a contractor. Knowing that many homeowners and DIYers are looking for a community to call home, we've created www.DIYChatroom.com DIY Chatroom is full of helpful advices and perfect for DIY homeowners.

Redirecing in 10 seconds
No Thanks
terms of service

Already Have an Account?