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09-04-2006, 07:25 PM
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#1
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Chief Toilet Mover
Trade:
Bathroom Remodeling
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Littleton, Colorado
Posts: 12,344
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How tall could you go?
So I've never ran across this before, but how tall of a building can you make out of just wood framing? 4 storys, 5? The biggest I have ever saw was some apartment buildings that were 4 stories tall, I didn't see any steel work in them at all.
I'm sure there are some structural limitations and maybe some economic limitations. Say for instance 4 stories might be the limit before you have to really begin over engineering the structure to get to 5 so it becomes less expensive to just get into steel?
__________________
bathroom remodeling - Denver, Lakewood, Littleton, Arvada, Westminster, Centennial, Highlands Ranch, Lone Tree, Englewood Colorado.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahren
Citibank BK Jan 2010, Dow 3000 Q1 2010,FAZ is about to go through the roof, stagflation, hyper-inflation, Jan 2010 $2.00 C puts
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09-04-2006, 08:11 PM
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#2
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Pro
Trade:
masonry
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Austin
Posts: 3,725
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I have seen some timbered 6-8 story factory buildings, but they were built long ago with big timbers, 18x18 red cyprus and such. With modern building lumber, I would say 4 stories is about it, and that is highly engineered.
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09-04-2006, 08:42 PM
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#3
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Pro
Trade:
Residential Contractor
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Jensen Beach, FL
Posts: 10,464
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7 floors is the most that I know of but if you look at some of the old mining structures, they went much more than that and supported a lot of weight.
__________________
You can't solve you're problems with the same level of thinking that created the problems.
Albert Einstein
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09-04-2006, 08:42 PM
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#4
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Pro
Trade:
GC. Apprentice electrician
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Colorado Front Range
Posts: 2,570
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I think fire ratings would be more of an issue. Under the old UBC it was type I, II, III construction. You would probably have a hard time doing a 2 story Wood framed Church, (A-3 occupancy) and keep the required fire seperation. Even in R-3 Divisions 1,2,&3, (houses, dorms ,hotels etc.), keeping the required fire seperation would be difficult after about 3 stories.
I think they did 7 story wood tenaments in the early 1900's and a lot of people died in them.
Insurance costs could also determine the type of construction you used.
Last edited by K2; 09-05-2006 at 10:58 AM.
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09-05-2006, 11:00 AM
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#5
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Pro
Trade:
Renovations
Join Date: May 2005
Location: West Coast Canada
Posts: 1,704
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Stick framing, probably four or five, timber framed buildings much taller, all those mediaeval church spires have been around for centuries.
__________________
"Too much is always better than not enough"--J.R. "Bob" Dobbs
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09-05-2006, 03:38 PM
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#6
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Remodeling Contractor
Trade:
Remodeling Contractor
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: CT. U.S.A.
Posts: 323
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rob 53
Insurance costs could also determine the type of construction you used.
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Of course it does, you can't fart without asking them first, they run the world.
__________________
"Man is a tool-using animal. Without tools he is nothing, with tools he is all."
Thomas Carlyle (1795-1881)
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09-05-2006, 10:38 PM
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#7
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Pro
Trade:
Framing
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Griswold, Iowa Southwest
Posts: 164
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We did stick framing up to 4 stories........the floor trusses and roof trusses were very well built and engineered.....lots of headers and microlamb in there too.......
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09-06-2006, 08:39 PM
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#8
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catalfanoc
Trade:
roofing and remodeling
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: outside Philadelphia
Posts: 43
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they built a 6 story apartment complex out of wood around me i was very surpised to see it
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09-06-2006, 09:35 PM
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#9
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Chief Toilet Mover
Trade:
Bathroom Remodeling
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Littleton, Colorado
Posts: 12,344
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Quote:
Originally Posted by catalfanoc
they built a 6 story apartment complex out of wood around me i was very surpised to see it
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It's kind of freaky to see something that tall made of wood isn't it? That's how I felt when I kept driving by these apartments they put up all in wood framing. Something just seemed strange about the whole thing.
__________________
bathroom remodeling - Denver, Lakewood, Littleton, Arvada, Westminster, Centennial, Highlands Ranch, Lone Tree, Englewood Colorado.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahren
Citibank BK Jan 2010, Dow 3000 Q1 2010,FAZ is about to go through the roof, stagflation, hyper-inflation, Jan 2010 $2.00 C puts
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09-07-2006, 02:32 PM
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#10
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Pro
Trade:
Framing
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Griswold, Iowa Southwest
Posts: 164
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I think they(our 4-5 story ones).....are quite sturdy......but my god, its pretty hard to keep them square/plumb..........
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09-07-2006, 03:50 PM
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#11
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stop botherin' me!
Trade:
Roofing Siding Gutters Windows
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Chicago
Posts: 7,666
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Having very limited experience with lumber I would be scared to build anything over 3 stories, I personally have never seen anything built with lumber over 3 stories. Infact most 3 story buildings, I have seen, are constructed with block.
I base my answer only upon my personal observations.
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09-07-2006, 04:40 PM
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#12
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DGR,IABD
Trade:
Electrical; Commercial and Residential Service
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Central PA
Posts: 9,665
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I've wired some buildings in years past, for an employer that were 4-5 stories all in wood. When you start going up like that, you have shear walls all over the place. Sorta turns the whole wall into an I-Joist (and obviously helps with the increased shear loading).
Last edited by mdshunk; 09-07-2006 at 04:44 PM.
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09-07-2006, 04:58 PM
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#13
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Chief Toilet Mover
Trade:
Bathroom Remodeling
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Littleton, Colorado
Posts: 12,344
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Yeah, speaking of shear, I can't imagine in California you can build with wood too high due to all the earth quake codes and requirements.
__________________
bathroom remodeling - Denver, Lakewood, Littleton, Arvada, Westminster, Centennial, Highlands Ranch, Lone Tree, Englewood Colorado.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ahren
Citibank BK Jan 2010, Dow 3000 Q1 2010,FAZ is about to go through the roof, stagflation, hyper-inflation, Jan 2010 $2.00 C puts
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09-07-2006, 07:36 PM
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#14
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Pro
Trade:
Carpenter by trade, lead man for commercial GC...
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Winnipeg, Manitoba
Posts: 937
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Up here, I was under the impression that 3 stories was the limit for a commercial building. But just the other day, drove by a job site where they are building a 4 story hotel with wood framing (but didn't get a chance to notice if they had beefed up the framing)... Interesting thread Mike...
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09-11-2006, 09:46 AM
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#15
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Pro
Trade:
architect
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 158
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Using the IRC, 1 & 2 family dwellings & townhouses that exceed the wind loadings in table 301.2 must be engineered or conform to the IBC. That table only goes up to a height of 30 ft. so 3 stories is the limit for light wood framed homes and townhouses are limited to 3 stories in the admin. section.
If the building use is other than 1 & 2 family or townhouses it must be designed by an architect or engineer and meet the height and area limits of the IBC for the use group and construction type. For protected light wood framing (Type V), Assembly would be 2 stories, Business 3, Education 1, Mercantile 3, and Residential 3, etc. Another story is allowed for a full sprinkler system. Heavy Timber framing (Type IV) and fire-retardant light wood framing (Type III) is allowed to be 1 to 2 stories taller depending on the use.
For HT and fire-treated light framing: A=4, B=6, E=4, M=5, R=5.
For untreated light wood framing: A=3, B=4, E=2, M=4, R=4.
So the tallest wood building would be 6 stories according to the IBC.
These limits may differ with other codes but since they are determined primarily for fire safety reasons and earthquake areas have stricter structural requirements, I doubt they are often allowed to be taller.
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09-11-2006, 10:32 AM
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#16
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Pro
Trade:
GC. Apprentice electrician
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Colorado Front Range
Posts: 2,570
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Quote:
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So the tallest wood building would be 6 stories according to the IBC.
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That's a bunch of trees. Good to hear from you MA.
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07-01-2007, 11:27 PM
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#17
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Think it Draw it Build it
Trade:
WA STATE GC Specialized in Structural Framing
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ferndale, Washington
Posts: 1,762
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This "thing" was the tallest I have built. 5 stories.
__________________
"I HAVE SWORN UPON THE ALTAR OF GOD, ETERNAL HOSTILITY AGAINST EVERY FORM OF TYRANNY OVER THE MIND OF MAN." THOMAS JEFFERSON
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07-02-2007, 02:06 AM
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#18
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Member
Trade:
General
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 53
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Keep in mind that elevator shafts arent supported with wood and they are usually designed to bear a lot of other loads imposed by the building.
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07-02-2007, 04:01 PM
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#19
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The Duke
Trade:
Custom Carpentry and Design
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Portland, Maine
Posts: 4,735
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Anyone seen Old Faithful Lodge? That sucker goes up a ways. 6 or 7 stories at least.
I think I also heard 3 stories was supposed to be max, but I'm sure there are alternatives to get around it.
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07-02-2007, 06:54 PM
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#20
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Moore Means Quality
Trade:
General Carpentry
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Lynnwood,WA
Posts: 1,739
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I have been on 4 and 5 story apartment/condo an 6 story hotel wood framed buildings. They use alot of hold down brackets that go from foundation to the roof. A 6 story was just build in Seattle. I think it is actually like 7 but the first story is all concrete with a post tension deck.
alot of it has to do with height restrictions on max storys.
As for fire rating party walls have a 2 hour (double 5/8's gyp on each side of p wall) burn through these days out here.
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@A Protected Twenty-Seven Simple But Powerful Words
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