Architects And Stairs

borat_borat1950

Does anybody out there wish that they actually had to build a set before they are are allowed to draw them? It seems like every set I build, either going up or down in smaller houses I either have to move the headout or add a winder on the landing. (Additional Angle platform tread). Going down if I add a tread on a straight run, there isn't enough landing space at the bottom, if I add a tread to the top, it usually goes into the hallway. On L-shapes if you add one to the bottom ( if you have room) it raises the platform to where you lose head height? It's rainy here and I'm in a bitchy mood, and was wondering if i'm the only one with this haedache?

Leo G

But it looks so pretty on paper. I haven't had to do a stair in quite a while. But just about every one I had done int he past had to be modified some how to make it fit.

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SCCTrim

It is a prerequisite that architects have no field experience whatsoever...



..thought everyone knew that

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rbsremodeling

i feel for all you guys that have to deal with ****tey architects.

I guess I am blessed here to design most of my work in house or the two architects that I do work with are very good and solicit my input during the design process.

I have not had a bad Architect experience in 10 years. Just thought I'd rub it in a bit

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KentWhitten

architects do not draw the plans most of the time. they just review them (and that's not very good either). they usually have one of the pre-architect student types do it.

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Joe Carola

Sounds like your running into this problem after you frame the house.Are you? This is the reason why it's up to us, the Framers to figure the correct openings BEFORE we frame the openings according to the plans. Where I'm from we don't cut the stairs for the inside of the house, we have stair companies do that. I cut all stairs on the decks.

But, I have to know how to cut stairs and know the correct openings and correct headroom before we frame. Many, many times they do not work after I figure the stairs and I have to adjust room sizes, hallways, even sometimes a header can go up inside a wall where there is a closet so that the closet floor is raised.

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Joe Carola

Bodger

Two months ago I had to raise the floor of a master bath shower by about 4" so I could acheive the proper vertical clearance for a set of stairs below.
Same problem, archy blew it. Lucky for everyone, I had room to do it. The next obstruction was a large Parrallam that obviously could not be cut or moved. We just missed that big boy.
Architects should stick to water colors.

Joe Carola

Was this new work or remodeling?

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Joe Carola

borat_borat1950

The answer to your first question, is YES on the first one, that was a lesson I'll never forget, but since then no. House has stairs, first thing I figure before i even start figureing footage. Like I said this mostly happens in smaller units. I'm kind of like a lab rat, if I stick my finger in a light socket and it hurts I don't do it again!!!

Joe Carola

But you're still correcting it before you frame, right? It still sounds like from your first post that you are still having problems after you frame , no matter if it's a small house or not. There shouldn't be any problems afterwords if it's figured out before.

When I figure the stairs for new work and remodeling and come up with a problem, I call the Builder/GC and let them know what has to be done. If it;s a major problem, I tell them to have their stair guy meet me out there and we discuss it and make the fix right there. I will move/change whatever I have too and be done with it.

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Joe Carola

borat_borat1950

Sorry, I wasn't very clear. I meant that now and ever since the first one, I always move headout and any walls during framing, not after!!

Joe Carola

Alright, you're still loosing me here. I'm not trying to be a d!ck, but in your first post, everything you say is talking about present time, now, you still have to make changes AFTER you have framed the houses.

Your last sentence, " and was wondering if i'm the only one with this haedache? It should have been, "am I the only one who used to have this headache?

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Joe Carola

borat_borat1950

Grammer and spelling stood corrected. Thank you. What I was getting at is that the dimentions on the plans for the hole in the floor should be drawn right.

critter

Ardhitects are like doctors. Some have a real passion for the craft - others heard it was a good way to make money. The ones lacking the passion tend to learn just enough to get paid and stay out of jail. The real architects usually look at the stairway as main element of design and actually work it into place, then design and adjust to keep it buildable and usable. The others just drag and click. ;-)

Bodger

New build, 2800 sf house.

Joe Carola

Like I said to borat, why are these problems happening AFTER your done framing, how come you don't figure out the stair openings and headroom heights FIRST? What would have happened if the Parallam was in the way? You would have to call the Archy up and change few things BEFORE you frame the WRONG building. You have responsibility as the framer to know how to figure out the Rough openings for stairs and see if they work before you frame.

If someone asks you what happened, you can't just say that, " well we followed the plans" They can ask you how come you couldn't figure out the stair openings and head height first. Would you say, " because I don't know how?"

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Joe Carola

Joe Carola

I'm the last one to correct grammar and spelling. I would never do that. To me, your entire first post is about correcting the framing after you are done because not getting the stairwell openings correct. As far as the Architect getting the correct dimensions for the openings, your 100% correct, they should, they have no excuse not too. We as Framers also have no excuse not to get them right and check every plan to see that they are right and make sure we catch any mistakes the Architects can make with these openings to see that they work.

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Joe Carola

Bodger

I know how. And caught it in time. My point was, and is, that if the architects would do their job correctly in the first place it would cut down a lot on corrections, be they before or after mistakes are made.

And not for nuthin' Joe, but in your posts and replies you talk pretty strong like you never made a mistake in your life whilst framing or reading and intrepreting a plan.

rbsremodeling

Why should it be a framers job to catch an Architects mistakes? Do you get paid to catch the Architects mistakes?

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Bodger

Good point
I don't get paid to check the archy's homework, I can tell you that.
And I've never seen an architect come to the job site and move a few trimmers out wider so I can get my doors hung without greasing the jambs if I framed the openings wrong.
I wouldn't want to sit and check the structural engineer's PLF calculations either.
If the plans call for a shear wall to be nailed off 4:4:12, am I supposed to run and check all the calculations in relation to all the other engineering to be certain that nailing schedule provides the proper deflection before I do the work?