Question For BDiamond --sales Related

Originally Posted by welterweight

BDiamond
expounding on how you refer to your windows as builders grade,mid range,and upscale..i use that terminology as well and then say upscale windows are also known as "investment grade windows".

i have a guy tonight who called me and asked if i can give him my very best pricing,which i already did at his home. i informed him that i am a very flexible person but he needs to understand that my bid may have been the highest,but my windows were also the highest quality. with that said,i told him i wouild talk to him IN PERSON and i am confident we can come to an agreement .

Originally Posted by BDiamond

4)before you start your presentation we just want to let you know we are NOT buying tonight

I have a project going on down the way. If I can get this thing put together for you where I can have my installers make it part of the other project and have the product delivered at the same time I can same everyone a bit of money.

I get my numbers together towards the end. "If you'd like me to leave you with bid or estimate your 10 windows will be $10,000. If we can make this part of the Johnson project I'd be able to do the project for around $7500.


I'd rather slide this in the calendar then have another job for $7500 than not have one at all because I don't have the slot for another 6 months.

Originally Posted by Mike Finley

You were doing great up until the end. Once you start lying to customers I have no respect for you. This is one of the reasons I can't stand the majority of salespeople in the home improvement industry. You guys make used car salesman look like saints. There is very little 'professionalism' in many home improvement salesman, and it's painfully obvious there is very little professional sales training in the industry.

The following is nothing but a bunch of lies.



Sure you can try to sugar coat it by saying, well I'm not really lying, we do have a project "down the way", with down the way being 25 miles away, but it's not what you are trying to put across to the customer. Piggy backing the order too to save the customer money is a lie. The other statements are lies too.

Like I said you were doing great right up to the point you have to start lying.

I've been in sales for a long, long time and have never lied to a customer and have never had to.

There is no room in sales or life for that matter to have to go around making your living by lying to people.

I'm also sorry that this thread has ran to 20 replies and not another single person has pointed this out. That's demonstrates the sh*tty state of affairs of the window industry as a whole.

I don't want to take away from 3/4 of what you said which was great, but you should take a hard look at yourself and ask yourself if you really need to lie to somebodies face to make a sale.

Originally Posted by Mike Finley

You were doing great up until the end. Once you start lying to customers I have no respect for you. This is one of the reasons I can't stand the majority of salespeople in the home improvement industry. You guys make used car salesman look like saints. There is very little 'professionalism' in many home improvement salesman, and it's painfully obvious there is very little professional sales training in the industry.

The following is nothing but a bunch of lies.



Sure you can try to sugar coat it by saying, well I'm not really lying, we do have a project "down the way", with down the way being 25 miles away, but it's not what you are trying to put across to the customer. Piggy backing the order too to save the customer money is a lie. The other statements are lies too.

Like I said you were doing great right up to the point you have to start lying.

I've been in sales for a long, long time and have never lied to a customer and have never had to.

There is no room in sales or life for that matter to have to go around making your living by lying to people.

I'm also sorry that this thread has ran to 20 replies and not another single person has pointed this out. That's demonstrates the sh*tty state of affairs of the window industry as a whole.

I don't want to take away from 3/4 of what you said which was great, but you should take a hard look at yourself and ask yourself if you really need to lie to somebodies face to make a sale.

Originally Posted by BDiamond

Hmmmmm......

First, thanks for acknowledging 3/4 of what I have to say is good stuff. That softened the blow a little!

The whole point in my logging in is to learn from others and perhaps share what I've learned. I didn't know if this was a good website for me because I'm a salesman and not a contractor and people wouldn't relate to what I had to say. I'm just selling a service or product. But I thought, "Well, I guess they need to SELL themselves, products, services so maybe we can all learn something.

So someone asks me some specific window and siding sales questions and here's the thread.

Let's address the issue. Everything was fine UNTIL the $10,000 vs. $7500/job down the street thing comes up.

First of all the way our company generates leads is canvassing. When I get appts . I'm in the same 1/2 mile x 1/2 mile area for 3-4 days. Then I'm 1/2 from that. So at any time I'm sitting with someone we have a job within a few blocks going up or completed. So in the "Pinefield" division....yes, there's one "down the way". The purpose from a company standpoint is to create buss in the neighborhood, gain social proof from the neighbors, and keep plenty of crew and material around.

I'll e-fax you some letters that say, "I was the reason they did the job," "We appreciated his No-nonsense No-Pressure approach to the process" "He was $6,000 more than any other person we talked to. We felt HE was committed to doing the job right and he delivered."

So when I tell someone something about the product, the company, me, our service, etc., it's the truth and I deliver EVERY time. I put my name on that contract and I will fight my own company to make sure the homeowner gets what I told them will.

If you read the top "Sales" books out one of the things they discuss is "Law of Scarcity". People will not buy now if not given a compelling reason to do so. Everyone,please send me a nickel for every time a potential client, after you've invested time as said, "We decided not to do that right now. Something has come up." So psychologically people want what they can't have. Trampled at WalMart trying to get the last Wii. $1000 Hannah Montana tickets for the nosebleed section. Like get REAL here.

Also, "The Law of Reciprocity". We just say that in welterweight post. The customer says I'll buy your windows (I'll scratch your back) if you drop the price to $10,500 (if you'll scratch mine). If it was customer's way they'd want you to give then the best project you can offer and just make enough to buy lunch. "Can you come down an bit?""Is that the best you can do?""If you tile the back splash for the same price I'll do it". Another nickel everyone please.

Any of you guys ever thought, "I could really use the work. At least it'll keep my guys busy." And you drop your price? Why can't I do that?
Plus our company doesn't have "Sales". "Buy 2 windows get 1 free" (That's 33% off by the way).

And lastly the margin vs. volume thing. 10 widgets at $10000 or 20 at $7500. I'll take 20.

So I UNDERSTAND you reading the thread an being appalled. But that's why I don't like these things sometime because you can't really make people understand all the factors that apply,

So if you read back what I am doing is taking everything a homeowner does to you in stages, "Let me think about it" "We decided to wait a bit""Can you come down a bit" I'm just addressing all that crap that keeps us all from making money but I'M doing it ALL IN ONE SHOT! If I don't as an industry....people don't buy.

So what works for my industry may not work for you. So I don't lie to my customers to get a sale. I give them a highly rated product, we have GREAT installers, we servcice all repairs in warranties in days, and we are actually a little below what other providers of the products charge so people get a good value.

Isn't that what we all do? Or at least are supposed to.

So if I used wording that you don't like....my apologies. Change it. The idea of the post was to show an example of the different "Laws". Those principals are the important part. In fact I'll change it now....

"Fred, I DO have a few jobs down the street and we ARE pretty busy. Aside from the fact that your windows are falling out of your stinking house I know you're going to procrastinate the hell out of this thing. I know you like everything I've told you. You shown me all the buying signals and your salivating. I'm telling you we're busy, which we are, so you might feel a little urgency in getting this done because people like what they can't have. Kind of like that 18 neighbor girl I see you glancing at through the window every 5 minutes."

"Now I know you're going to tell me you want other bids. You really don't. Want you want is someone who can give you what you want, at a price you want to pay, because that's what you can afford. You don't know why it's 3 bids and not 6 or 12. And you know you'll probably pick the middle because that's what "people", whomever "they" are, tell us too. Really what you want is, at the very least, a security blanket so if you get screwed and someone says, "Well cripes Fred! How many bids did you get?" You can at least say, "Well, I got three and he seemed best outta the lot." You're immune cause you did your due diligence.

"These windows aren't $10,000 Fred. After it's all done They're probably $4500 TMLF. But everyone else charges $10,000 and gets it so why shouldn't we right? But then we have to sit and wait for you to call while we're still payin the light bill, the installers are sneakin a box of trim coil and caulk her and there to do side jobs to survive. So instead of inflating our prices over our competition and coming down with a "Buy 2 windows get 1 free!" add I'm gonna do it different! Are you excited Fred? Well, you should be!"

"Now, I know you were going to call me later and try to get me to drop the price. I know Fred, don't be ashamed. Just part of the game you customers do. But I'm going to get that all out of the way so you can get over to that neighbor while the wife's still at work. You don't have to procrastinate or sit through 5 more demos because we are a perfect fit. I didn't have to tell you we're in the neighborhood and busy but it gets those juices flowing so now you're ready to go. And I know you feel like I owe you something because I'm a home improvement guy and we depend on you homeowners so I'm gonna institute a 25% off sale JUST FOR YOU GIVING ME YOUR BUSINESS TODAY FRED!"

"If you don't Fred....I don't care. Don't get me wrong. We both know I'd do a great job. But we have employees that need checks to feed the kids. So I've got to find homeowners that grasp this concept and leave you to sludge through the guys that really ARE creepy and tell you how their window is the greatest on earth..and just show you the brochure.'

"I'll get the forms started. Why don't you invite your neighbor over some lemonade. She is kinda cute."

Happy? (I might start using this! See we can synergize and learn!)

So if that process allows someone to improve their home and change their life because all the other "esitmators" never dealt with their inner fears, concerns, or hesitencies then I'll keep my way, however you "classify" it. Ever tell your wife, "No honey, it looks great!" Nickel please...

And the crowd goes wild.................

Originally Posted by abacab

for me, if a salesman makes any attempt to close on the same day, he's out the door.

Originally Posted by Mike Finley

You were doing great up until the end. Once you start lying to customers I have no respect for you. This is one of the reasons I can't stand the majority of salespeople in the home improvement industry. You guys make used car salesman look like saints. There is very little 'professionalism' in many home improvement salesman, and it's painfully obvious there is very little professional sales training in the industry.

The following is nothing but a bunch of lies.



Sure you can try to sugar coat it by saying, well I'm not really lying, we do have a project "down the way", with down the way being 25 miles away, but it's not what you are trying to put across to the customer. Piggy backing the order too to save the customer money is a lie. The other statements are lies too.

Like I said you were doing great right up to the point you have to start lying.

I've been in sales for a long, long time and have never lied to a customer and have never had to.

There is no room in sales or life for that matter to have to go around making your living by lying to people.

I'm also sorry that this thread has ran to 20 replies and not another single person has pointed this out. That's demonstrates the sh*tty state of affairs of the window industry as a whole.

I don't want to take away from 3/4 of what you said which was great, but you should take a hard look at yourself and ask yourself if you really need to lie to somebodies face to make a sale.

Originally Posted by buildsmart

Why would you kick him out if he tried to get to the point and get your business???? I have closed over 800,000 in biz same day in the last six months because i am a salesman who knows whats going on. I run about 4 leads a week while I run my company. I am not so much an owner/general contractor as I am a professional salesman. My clients appreciate the fact I dont play games and I am to the point. I'm sorry you feel that way but there are a lot of guys out there who can not afford to chase a client when they have many other leads to run. I dish out a couple hundred bucks a lead and coming back does not pay my bills and keep my company in the black. Any salesman who cannot close the same night is not worth hiring. That's just how it is. There is nothing wrong with laying it out professionally and earning a clients business in a couple hours. Clients do not want to sit with contractors on 4 occasions to hire someone. They want to hire who they trust with their money and if that so happens to be the same night then kudos to the salesman for doing his job.

Originally Posted by Mike Finley

You were doing great up until the end. Once you start lying to customers I have no respect for you. This is one of the reasons I can't stand the majority of salespeople in the home improvement industry. You guys make used car salesman look like saints. There is very little 'professionalism' in many home improvement salesman, and it's painfully obvious there is very little professional sales training in the industry.

The following is nothing but a bunch of lies.



Sure you can try to sugar coat it by saying, well I'm not really lying, we do have a project "down the way", with down the way being 25 miles away, but it's not what you are trying to put across to the customer. Piggy backing the order too to save the customer money is a lie. The other statements are lies too.

Like I said you were doing great right up to the point you have to start lying.

I've been in sales for a long, long time and have never lied to a customer and have never had to.

There is no room in sales or life for that matter to have to go around making your living by lying to people.

I'm also sorry that this thread has ran to 20 replies and not another single person has pointed this out. That's demonstrates the sh*tty state of affairs of the window industry as a whole.

I don't want to take away from 3/4 of what you said which was great, but you should take a hard look at yourself and ask yourself if you really need to lie to somebodies face to make a sale.

Originally Posted by buddy110

What's your average ticket?

Originally Posted by buildsmart

around 18-20k