Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change!

Mike Finley · 12-05-2007, 04:19 PM

About once a month somebody posts here asking what your favorite form of advertising or what should I advertise in or what works.

How about we look at it differently, name some of the advertising you have tried that doesn't work for you and why you think so.

ockitchensolver · 12-05-2007, 05:02 PM

1. Insert Ads in Pennysaver Publications
2. All On-line Lead Generation Services
3. Chamber of Commerce community events
4. Yellow Jacket advertiseing ( A Vinyl phone book slip cover that is sent to residents by demo info, where you buy space, the idea being if somebody does put it on their yellow book phonebook, your ad is the fist they see...Sounds good in theory only, and damn expensive )
5. Consumer product publications that are free to Home owners.
6. Door Hangers
7. Door flyers
8. Home-Shows in SoCal, over saturated, and over priced.
9. Angies list, The End Result, and any and all types of these local contractor referral service's, they charge 7% of your gross contract.
10. Networking with Wanna-be designers, get you in more trouble than they are worth.
And these are just some of what DID NOT work for us this year.

dirt diggler · 12-05-2007, 05:10 PM

phone book

Stone Mountain · 12-05-2007, 05:16 PM

Yellow pages.
I have been advertizing with them since I started in business. In 06, I booked from June 06 to June 07. The total was $1950 a month. The Y.P rep tried to talk me into more, so on her advice we started really tracking where our leads were coming from. Every year, we advertise in a little magazine that gets mailed out to most of Toronto, about 800,000 single family homes. None go to apartments or condos. The magazine comes out in March, April, May, June, July, September and October.
I always skip MArch, and usually October, although the owner usually calls me and gives me a half price deal for October.
When the magazine comes out, I get hundreds of calls, to the point that this year with 5 sales people we couldn't keep up with the number of leads.`
This lasts for 2-3 weeks after the magazine comes out.
The tracking showed us that during the time the magazine was working, we got virtually no calls through the YP.
In between the issues, we got calls, but not nearly as many. ALso, the closing ratio was less.
We are also getting more and more calls "from the Internet".
Anyway, by the end of the year it was approximately 15-1 in favour of the magazine for the # of leads.
This year, the YP rep came to see me, and I dropped the YP alltogether. A week after, she came back with her superior, and they double teamed me for 3 hours to try to convince me. I resisted, so I am no longer in the book at all.

What happened? My sales are up 30%, my advertising cost is half. I won't be going back!

firemike · 12-05-2007, 05:24 PM

YellowBook
Angies List
AdCart

dirt diggler · 12-05-2007, 05:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stone Mountain

Yellow pages.
I have been advertizing with them since I started in business. In 06, I booked from June 06 to June 07. The total was $1950 a month. The Y.P rep tried to talk me into more, so on her advice we started really tracking where our leads were coming from. Every year, we advertise in a little magazine that gets mailed out to most of Toronto, about 800,000 single family homes. None go to apartments or condos. The magazine comes out in March, April, May, June, July, September and October.
I always skip MArch, and usually October, although the owner usually calls me and gives me a half price deal for October.
When the magazine comes out, I get hundreds of calls, to the point that this year with 5 sales people we couldn't keep up with the number of leads.`
This lasts for 2-3 weeks after the magazine comes out.
The tracking showed us that during the time the magazine was working, we got virtually no calls through the YP.
In between the issues, we got calls, but not nearly as many. ALso, the closing ratio was less.
We are also getting more and more calls "from the Internet".
Anyway, by the end of the year it was approximately 15-1 in favour of the magazine for the # of leads.
This year, the YP rep came to see me, and I dropped the YP alltogether. A week after, she came back with her superior, and they double teamed me for 3 hours to try to convince me. I resisted, so I am no longer in the book at all.

What happened? My sales are up 30%, my advertising cost is half. I won't be going back!

that's great to hear stone

my anti-YP sentiment is from a similar situation ...

i got the same double-teaming (via phone though) when i told em "nope" ....

as expensive as it is - i'd much rather at least try keeping it - or putting it elsewhere into other types of marketing

threaderman · 12-05-2007, 05:43 PM

I tried a community paper this past year.It is a free yet popular publication with a circulation area of about 20,000.I ran 2 -1/2 page ads and 6- 1/4 page ads .The ad was printed on the most read pages for the area,the recipe page and the word search page for the smaller ad and the paper is printed every 2 weeks.Ran 3 months,notta one call.

Putty Truck · 12-05-2007, 06:27 PM

There are some small town weeklies I won't run in because I don't like the town and I mean flat out won't work there.

Some of my y.p. ads are worthless, but for 400.00/mth for a full page, 1st position, I'll keep it going for bragging rights.

silvertree · 12-05-2007, 06:54 PM

Yellow Pages don't work for me, few calls and not very good leads and you get lost in the crowd.
Glossy handouts like a monthly magazine didn't work well, expensive and you get all the calls at once so your spinning your tires and 3 days later the magazine is in the recycle bin and nothing happens. Home shows, there are too many and it has become an event only if there is nothing on TV or the weather is bad.

Mike Finley · 12-05-2007, 07:03 PM

YP don't work for me. I think if you're service you gotta be there, but for remodelers they are a waste of time.

Everytime they call me they get pissed off because when they ask why I tell them because I don't want the type of customers you could deliver, and number 2 you don't deliver many customers anyways. They get super pissed off and always assume you're a bumbling goob contractor who's idea of advertising is the yellow pages. When they ask in that superior tone, what other type of advertising we do and I rattle it off they pretty much are done at that point, especially after I tell them I wouldn't take one of your ads for free.

oldfrt · 12-05-2007, 07:08 PM

I haven't done any advertising in years,but with things slowing down I may start, but no YP ads.Tried that,lots of shoppers.One guy actually wanted me to make him a material list.It was 3 barns and a house roofing project.

I've had better luck in a free weekly bargain journal,delivered in a 40 mile radius in the mail.
My sister is managing editor so she can get me good positioning.

Duane1982 · 12-05-2007, 07:25 PM

I know it's a tid bit off topic but has anyone done yellowpages.com? they keep calling with the pitch I get a lead tracking phone number and 3-500 leads a month for 113.00? Numbers are based on my geographical area. Sounds like a scam to me. I use servicemagic and they suck 80% of the time, customer service reps are as smooth as felons.

silvertree · 12-05-2007, 07:40 PM

I would guess Yellow Pages.com is going to be a lot like Yellow Pages the book. $113 is cheap for 3 to 500 leads, too cheap "so I ask ya, do ya feel lucky, well, do ya"?

threaderman · 12-05-2007, 08:13 PM

I have a YP.com internet ad ,bein on-line for at least a month.Somehow I manage to always be listed in the first 4 plumbing companys in this area,which is awesome,but no calls yet.One thing I am lacking is a web-site.I am in the process of doing some minor changes in the coverage area verbage as well.I'll let you know if it helps.

Bryan C · 12-05-2007, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ockitchensolver

1. Insert Ads in Pennysaver Publications
2. All On-line Lead Generation Services
3. Chamber of Commerce community events
4. Yellow Jacket advertiseing ( A Vinyl phone book slip cover that is sent to residents by demo info, where you buy space, the idea being if somebody does put it on their yellow book phonebook, your ad is the fist they see...Sounds good in theory only, and damn expensive )
5. Consumer product publications that are free to Home owners.
6. Door Hangers
7. Door flyers
8. Home-Shows in SoCal, over saturated, and over priced.
9. Angies list, The End Result, and any and all types of these local contractor referral service's, they charge 7% of your gross contract.
10. Networking with Wanna-be designers, get you in more trouble than they are worth.
And these are just some of what DID NOT work for us this year.

Angie's List charges you for referrals? I thought it was just a place to bad mouth contractors...

wackman · 12-05-2007, 08:19 PM

I know someone who just started working for yellowpages.com. Those guys are making big money (150k) and I got the same speech about 500 leads from one of their other salesmen, but my friend said that there is 500 hits to that specific part of the search (remodeling) a month. My website gets 500 hits a day and I've gotten no jobs from it so what can I expect from 500 hits a month plus it's shared by everyone in that catagory?

Bryan C · 12-05-2007, 08:20 PM

I haven't ventured in the SM game yet but it seems managable and relatively cheap per lead. I've heard the good and bad but think I may try it to say I've tried it. Is there any minimum commitment of time written anywhere when you sign up? Can I cancel everything after I get a month of junk leads?

Something that I tried and wouldn't recommend - grocery cart advertising at 8 Krogers. Costly and nothing but tire kickers...

**Nathan** · 12-05-2007, 08:23 PM

I think it totally depends on the area.

silvertree · 12-05-2007, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bryan C

I haven't ventured in the SM game yet but it seems managable and relatively cheap per lead. I've heard the good and bad but think I will try to say I tried it. Is there any minimum commitment of time written anywhere when you sign up? Can I cancel everything after I get a month of junk leads?

Something that I tried and wouldn't recommend - grocery cart advertising at 8 Krogers. Costly and nothing but tire kickers...

If your trying Service Magic I wish you luck, who knows. If I were to try an online lead service again I would do this---After you sign for a month, 1 week after signing call the credit card company and tell them not to accept any more charges from that company, or the moment you feel like your getting screwed make that call. Once they get your card number you are no longer in control. I'll bet a lot of guys on this forum have had to fight for their money.

ruskent · 12-05-2007, 08:47 PM

I do not think there is a clear line between what works and what doesn't. The advertising i used 2 years ago produced work. However, i would not consider using that form of adverting for my business now. My business has evolved so much that i would not think of doing those jobs i did two years ago today.

But if i did the advertising i do now 2 years ago, there is no way i would of been able to sell the jobs that the ads produced.

Basicaly, i think all advertising pretty much works to a extended. However, not all advertising is a perfect match for every business.

12-05-2007, 04:19 PM	#1
Mike Finley View Profile Mike Finley Chief Toilet Mover Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (14,078) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Chief Toilet Mover Trade: Bathroom Remodeling Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Littleton, Colorado Posts: 14,078	Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! About once a month somebody posts here asking what your favorite form of advertising or what should I advertise in or what works. How about we look at it differently, name some of the advertising you have tried that doesn't work for you and why you think so.

12-05-2007, 05:02 PM	#2
ockitchensolver View Profile ockitchensolver Registered User Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (17) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Registered User Trade: Cabinet Refacing, New Cabinets, Kitchen Design Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 17	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! 1. Insert Ads in Pennysaver Publications 2. All On-line Lead Generation Services 3. Chamber of Commerce community events 4. Yellow Jacket advertiseing ( A Vinyl phone book slip cover that is sent to residents by demo info, where you buy space, the idea being if somebody does put it on their yellow book phonebook, your ad is the fist they see...Sounds good in theory only, and damn expensive ) 5. Consumer product publications that are free to Home owners. 6. Door Hangers 7. Door flyers 8. Home-Shows in SoCal, over saturated, and over priced. 9. Angies list, The End Result, and any and all types of these local contractor referral service's, they charge 7% of your gross contract. 10. Networking with Wanna-be designers, get you in more trouble than they are worth. And these are just some of what DID NOT work for us this year.

12-05-2007, 05:10 PM	#3
dirt diggler View Profile dirt diggler Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (3,309) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: contractor Join Date: May 2006 Location: east Posts: 3,309	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! phone book __________________ Thanks in advance!!!

12-05-2007, 05:16 PM	#4
Stone Mountain View Profile Stone Mountain Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (1,437) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: Outdoor contracting: fences and decks Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,437	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! Yellow pages. I have been advertizing with them since I started in business. In 06, I booked from June 06 to June 07. The total was $1950 a month. The Y.P rep tried to talk me into more, so on her advice we started really tracking where our leads were coming from. Every year, we advertise in a little magazine that gets mailed out to most of Toronto, about 800,000 single family homes. None go to apartments or condos. The magazine comes out in March, April, May, June, July, September and October. I always skip MArch, and usually October, although the owner usually calls me and gives me a half price deal for October. When the magazine comes out, I get hundreds of calls, to the point that this year with 5 sales people we couldn't keep up with the number of leads.` This lasts for 2-3 weeks after the magazine comes out. The tracking showed us that during the time the magazine was working, we got virtually no calls through the YP. In between the issues, we got calls, but not nearly as many. ALso, the closing ratio was less. We are also getting more and more calls "from the Internet". Anyway, by the end of the year it was approximately 15-1 in favour of the magazine for the # of leads. This year, the YP rep came to see me, and I dropped the YP alltogether. A week after, she came back with her superior, and they double teamed me for 3 hours to try to convince me. I resisted, so I am no longer in the book at all. What happened? My sales are up 30%, my advertising cost is half. I won't be going back! __________________ Residential Deck Specialist: Vist our Website www.fenceanddeck.ca

12-05-2007, 05:24 PM	#5
firemike View Profile firemike Professional Remodeler Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (2,289) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Professional Remodeler Trade: Remodeling Contractor Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Southeast Michigan Posts: 2,289	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! YellowBook Angies List AdCart __________________ -Mike- Falcon Contracting Residential - Commercial http://www.falconcontracting.biz

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12-05-2007, 05:43 PM	#7
threaderman View Profile threaderman Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (1,178) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: Plumbing & Gas Contractor Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Oklahoma city Posts: 1,178	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I tried a community paper this past year.It is a free yet popular publication with a circulation area of about 20,000.I ran 2 -1/2 page ads and 6- 1/4 page ads .The ad was printed on the most read pages for the area,the recipe page and the word search page for the smaller ad and the paper is printed every 2 weeks.Ran 3 months,notta one call.

12-05-2007, 06:27 PM	#8
Putty Truck View Profile Putty Truck Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (732) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: hjrafiuoashfed Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 732	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! There are some small town weeklies I won't run in because I don't like the town and I mean flat out won't work there. Some of my y.p. ads are worthless, but for 400.00/mth for a full page, 1st position, I'll keep it going for bragging rights.

12-05-2007, 06:54 PM	#9
silvertree View Profile silvertree Certified Remodeler Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (3,207) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Certified Remodeler Trade: Kitchen bath remodeler Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: North Oaks,MN Posts: 3,207	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! Yellow Pages don't work for me, few calls and not very good leads and you get lost in the crowd. Glossy handouts like a monthly magazine didn't work well, expensive and you get all the calls at once so your spinning your tires and 3 days later the magazine is in the recycle bin and nothing happens. Home shows, there are too many and it has become an event only if there is nothing on TV or the weather is bad. Last edited by silvertree; 12-05-2007 at 06:56 PM. Reason: Add content

12-05-2007, 07:03 PM	#10
Mike Finley View Profile Mike Finley Chief Toilet Mover Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (14,078) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Chief Toilet Mover Trade: Bathroom Remodeling Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Littleton, Colorado Posts: 14,078	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! YP don't work for me. I think if you're service you gotta be there, but for remodelers they are a waste of time. Everytime they call me they get pissed off because when they ask why I tell them because I don't want the type of customers you could deliver, and number 2 you don't deliver many customers anyways. They get super pissed off and always assume you're a bumbling goob contractor who's idea of advertising is the yellow pages. When they ask in that superior tone, what other type of advertising we do and I rattle it off they pretty much are done at that point, especially after I tell them I wouldn't take one of your ads for free.

12-05-2007, 07:08 PM	#11
oldfrt View Profile oldfrt Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (2,044) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: Remodeling Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Northwest Connecticut Posts: 2,044	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I haven't done any advertising in years,but with things slowing down I may start, but no YP ads.Tried that,lots of shoppers.One guy actually wanted me to make him a material list.It was 3 barns and a house roofing project. I've had better luck in a free weekly bargain journal,delivered in a 40 mile radius in the mail. My sister is managing editor so she can get me good positioning.

12-05-2007, 07:25 PM	#12
Duane1982 View Profile Duane1982 Duane Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (125) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Duane Trade: Roofing Siding and remodeling Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Wolcott NY Posts: 125	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I know it's a tid bit off topic but has anyone done yellowpages.com? they keep calling with the pitch I get a lead tracking phone number and 3-500 leads a month for 113.00? Numbers are based on my geographical area. Sounds like a scam to me. I use servicemagic and they suck 80% of the time, customer service reps are as smooth as felons.

12-05-2007, 07:40 PM	#13
silvertree View Profile silvertree Certified Remodeler Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (3,207) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Certified Remodeler Trade: Kitchen bath remodeler Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: North Oaks,MN Posts: 3,207	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I would guess Yellow Pages.com is going to be a lot like Yellow Pages the book. $113 is cheap for 3 to 500 leads, too cheap "so I ask ya, do ya feel lucky, well, do ya"?

12-05-2007, 08:13 PM	#14
threaderman View Profile threaderman Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (1,178) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: Plumbing & Gas Contractor Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Oklahoma city Posts: 1,178	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I have a YP.com internet ad ,bein on-line for at least a month.Somehow I manage to always be listed in the first 4 plumbing companys in this area,which is awesome,but no calls yet.One thing I am lacking is a web-site.I am in the process of doing some minor changes in the coverage area verbage as well.I'll let you know if it helps.

12-05-2007, 08:19 PM	#16
wackman View Profile wackman Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (889) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: Builder, Additions, large remodels...Lately also small remodels....... Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Portland Oregon Posts: 889	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I know someone who just started working for yellowpages.com. Those guys are making big money (150k) and I got the same speech about 500 leads from one of their other salesmen, but my friend said that there is 500 hits to that specific part of the search (remodeling) a month. My website gets 500 hits a day and I've gotten no jobs from it so what can I expect from 500 hits a month plus it's shared by everyone in that catagory?

12-05-2007, 08:20 PM	#17
Bryan C View Profile Bryan C Member Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (53) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Member Trade: Residential/Commerical Pressure Cleaning Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Indianapolis, Indiana Posts: 53	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I haven't ventured in the SM game yet but it seems managable and relatively cheap per lead. I've heard the good and bad but think I may try it to say I've tried it. Is there any minimum commitment of time written anywhere when you sign up? Can I cancel everything after I get a month of junk leads? Something that I tried and wouldn't recommend - grocery cart advertising at 8 Krogers. Costly and nothing but tire kickers... __________________ Bryan Corns Owner, Hydroblast Pressure Cleaning Inc. Indianapolis Power Washing Contractor YouTube Video Last edited by Bryan C; 12-05-2007 at 10:49 PM.

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12-05-2007, 08:23 PM	#18
Nathan View Profile Nathan Administrator Send Message Follow Blogs (5) Threads (8,388) Photos (0) Reviews (3) Projects (0) Toolbox (8) View All Activity Administrator Trade: Admin Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Texas Posts: 8,388	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I think it totally depends on the area. __________________ Nathan "He is no fool who gives what he cannot keep to gain that which he cannot lose." - Jim Elliot

12-05-2007, 08:47 PM	#20
ruskent View Profile ruskent Pro Send Message Follow Blogs (0) Threads (1,884) Photos (0) Reviews (0) Projects (0) Toolbox (0) View All Activity Pro Trade: Outdoor D/B Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 1,884	Re: Let's Talk About What Advertising Doesn't Work For A Change! I do not think there is a clear line between what works and what doesn't. The advertising i used 2 years ago produced work. However, i would not consider using that form of adverting for my business now. My business has evolved so much that i would not think of doing those jobs i did two years ago today. But if i did the advertising i do now 2 years ago, there is no way i would of been able to sell the jobs that the ads produced. Basicaly, i think all advertising pretty much works to a extended. However, not all advertising is a perfect match for every business.