RRP And The EPA Must Be Stopped

FStephenMasek

Yes, for total demolition nothing has changed - you still need asbestos and lead surveys, then need to handle the various materials properly. That has been the case for many years. What has changed, but not due to RRP, is that more and more cities are requiring substantial amounts of recycling, but materials with lead paint or asbestos are generally not able to be recycled, so are taken out of the calculations. The exception is steel and other metals, as they are readily recycled, lead paint or not.
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ZOLOFT SETTLEMENTS

ApgarNJ

it shouldn;t be abatement. because right now its perfectly legal to dispose of products with lead paint on them, into a normal landfill. RRP wants us to wrap the small stuff in plastic but for a whole house demo, not all the pieces are lead painted. plus, how many demos have they done in the past where they never went through and abated a whole house prior to tearing it down to the ground.

RRP is for harming kids and adults during/after a renovation. when you tear a whole structure down, the family is no longer a factor. therefore, RRP shouldn't apply.

DWind

And here is me eating my words. Just found 3 articles that point to lead as a cause for autism. Search before you type I guess.

FStephenMasek

That is not correct in some states, as the rules vary from state to state. For example, in all of California, unless the items with lead are a small enough percentage of the entire waste that the waste passes the profile testing (or you can calculate from the known weight of lead and the known weight of the entire waste that the lead is a small enough percentage).

The concern over disposal is leaching of lead into ground water.
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abacab

I remember a few years back OSHA was going to start requiring all kinds of new safety laws for residential home builders (harness for working on anything above 6 foot, etc) and the day before the law was to take effect it was recinded (don't remember the exact details) There also were new laws for stairs, requiring an 11x7 step and a similar thing happened. If we all make enough noise, lead containment will go the same way.

I remember my roofer went out and bought a bunch of expensive harnesses (300 a pop I believe) and he got injured from tripping over the cord on the roof. He took at least 3 bad spills, although he didn't fall to the ground.

HomerJ

If it's virtually impossible to be 100% compliant on every job, then we're just rolling the dice every time we step foot inside a home built before 1978. That's a very uncomfortable feeling, and it's no way to run a business.

63% of the homes my company worked in last year were built pre-1978. I have a hard time believing the majority of those HO's would've paid us 35-40% more for the same work. As many have suggested, a lot of that biz will now go to the hacks, or be done as DIY.

I think Mike hit on a key point. HO's need to take the responsibility here. Why are these EPA mandates directed at the construction industry?

Aside from writing to my congressman, what else can I do to help?

I'm attending my cert clas on Tue.

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Northwest Indiana General Contractor
Northwest Indiana Remodeling Contractor
Indiana Bath Remodeling
Indiana Kitchen Remodeling

sayswho

2 things i am curious about... who did you do your training with if you dont mind me asking and can your trainer reference anything in writing in regards to the ababtement contractor part? that part is throwing me..

SLSTech

Ok I am confused? Why can't you guys be compliant? It is just a bathroom - we are not talking about a whole house remodel of a Victorian Manor

Yank the toilet, and anything not painted... Run the plastic from the front door of the house to the bathroom, Place a 10' X 6' piece of plastic outside the bathroom door, if the floor is staying - put plastic on it

Grab your leftover plastic, bags , trash cans, etc... and get the demo done - bagging or wrapping the materials before pulling them out - do your clean up steps & verification an hour later - your done

yes I left out the paperwork steps - but that applies to everyone

You are looking at maybe a few additional hours work & more plastic than you normally use but not a 35% upcharge - You should be able to demo all painted and stained materials within a day allowing you to go back to your normal steps

The junk you hear about Tyvek suits, respirators, etc... is not required by the EPA - that's OSHA, make sure you read the actual regulation

Back to the what can you do - write & call your senators, congressmen, inform the newspapers, TV, etc... Learn what the regs really require

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Alabama Full Service Remodeling, Renovation, and Preservation by SLS Construction
Certified Energy Efficiency Audits, Ratings, Modeling, Verifications, & Consulting
Residential, Commercial, & Industrial Infrared Thermography Scans

notillegal

I would be willing to bet that the unions are all on board with this fiasco, great way to cripple the little guy so he can be "Assimilated" into the collective. Wow that sounds really socialist. hmmmm.

Tom R

It's not about not wanting to be compliant, it's about putting a bullseye on your chest for unnecessary but inevitable government fines and intrusion.

This isn't about lead, it's about money and freedom.

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Tom R

That's my theory, too, - - it's to cripple us into submission and throw all residential construction right to the unions. Payback time.

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Tom R

Obviously no sense posting it again, - - just for some mod to toss it out the window, - - but I've already shown proof of the EPA's quest for power at the expense, rather than the saving of children's lives.

Anything in sight can and will be used as a crisis, conveniently much to their monetary delight, even something that hasn't been around for decades.

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rselectric1

http://www.rrprenovatortraining.com/index.htm

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220...221...whatever it takes!

Mike Finley

The one thing that this site has taught me over the years is that I draw my experiences from my situation and my situation is almost guaranteed not to be your situation and the next guys and the next guys.

Also the bigger the project the more expensive the project the more changes there are during the process the more invasive the process. A typical small 5x9 bathroom is not the same process as a large 12x20 one. One that requires extensive plumbing, electrical, heating is a lot different then one where you are changing out an old cast iron 60x30 tub and doing an update.

We could go back and forth all night but I can assure you that if you and I visited each others job sites for a week or two we would discover that you and I do a lot of things differently and there would be many.. "Oh, I see..." moments.

I think it's great that the way you are doing things will transition so easily to the RRP rules. My methods and my situation won't so easily. Might be hard to believe, but 2 guys siting in front of computers don't have any frame of reference what the other is actually doing on a daily basis.

TimNJ

Just to hijack this for a minute. This is how insurance co's work too. A couple years ago somebody was involved in a MV accident in the town I live in with someone that has a similar name. The insurance co calls me on my unlisted private house line (where do they get that info) and leave a message blaming me for the accident!! I wasted half a day with those PROGRESSIVE jackasses and all the idiot did was say" we do this all the time. We figure a certain percentage will stick".

TimNJ

Doubtful. They will be the easiest targets. If you aren't registered all the auditors have to do is find your co in the phonebook, internet, newspaper ad and then since you haven't taken the course or registered your firm and the auditor sees you aren't listed, you better have some paperwork to back up that you haven't worked on a pre-78 bldg. No paperwork to prove that and you will be slammed.
Going with TomR's idea and not work on pre78 is good, just cross your t's and dot your i's so if they come afetr you you can shove it in their face.

HomerJ

My post states IF it's virtually impossible. I'm assuming worst case scenario right now, but won't know for sure until I attend the class.

I'll also reserve final judgement on the additional costs until I've taken the class and read the supporting documentation.

But from what I understand thus far, I could be looking at additional costs for: insurance, special equipment, handling of hazardous waste if the state requires it, owner and employee certification and training, and the additional materials and labor per job.

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Northwest Indiana General Contractor
Northwest Indiana Remodeling Contractor
Indiana Bath Remodeling
Indiana Kitchen Remodeling

SLSTech

Mike & J - I hear you, but if you read the actual reg (not the trainers whacked out interpretation) it is not that hard for the compliance, especially if you get rid of any LBP surface during demo. Now if you test & find lead is present than it just got harder as you have to apply all the OSHA regs - and on that one I agree, it is near impossible to be a 100% compliant. J you are also correct on additional costs, but unless you only work on 1 or 2 pre 78 jobs, you are not adding 35 to 40% of the costs to those jobs. In fact most of those costs are now getting applied to everyones job.

Tom - you are preaching to the choir, I have stated plenty of times that this reg will probably not help 1 child. This should have been rolled out years ago as best practices with an explanation on why - imagine how many that may have helped as the "dust free" systems would probably be more widespread and accepted

__________________
Alabama Full Service Remodeling, Renovation, and Preservation by SLS Construction
Certified Energy Efficiency Audits, Ratings, Modeling, Verifications, & Consulting
Residential, Commercial, & Industrial Infrared Thermography Scans

skarrlette

HI to the contractor that started this thread, how many contractors do you think we can get to sign a petition and letter? All on this site? If so would this be as state by state basis? I noted that you live in Colorado and I live in Mass. I think if we could get enough letters and signatures we would at least be heard.

I am late coming in on this but I have been on my state webpage and there was a deadline for giving feedback of March 12 on the page. Though I could are less about deadlines. I think if we get enough industry professionals to sign and create and uproar at least it might make the news.

But my question is can this be done nationally or is it state by state?

Also if we pool our resources maybe we will get more attention, we can contact news stations etc etc and try!

The thing is this why aren't they creating a law to make homeowners get a lead check when they are purchasing the property? They pay for the test and then they know and have to disclose to contractors. Then when the contractor comes to their homes the contractor can ask for the documentation showing a yes or no on lead then decide if they wish to perform services at that residence.

This should not be a "assume" it is lead situation we have rights too. Maybe I want to refuse to work on properties known to have lead. Just assuming that if it was built before 78' there is lead is not good enough, lead paint was actually very expensive not everyone could afford to buy lead paint therefore not every home before 78' has lead. I want the choice to decide how I proceed.

Let me know

Mike Finley

You bring up good points about the lead check!

I don't know about the petition, how it would work, that will take more time to figure out. Are there any online resources where you can start a petition online and then they print it and mail it off for a fee? Signing online seems to be the way to go, but I would think you would need an actual document to send.

Sending the letters or emails themselves would be from each contractor and would be an accumulative thing that our representatives would keep getting.. oh here's another one... two days later... another one... a week later.. another one.. till it dawns on them that something is going on.