Your Work, Customers Work, Whos Got A Permit?

Patrick

I got to thinking today, Say you are a GC that does just about everything, and are licensed to do so. You sign a job, but you are booked, and they go on your waiting list. 3 months later, its time to do the job and you go pull a permit to install say windows, doors, siding. You arrive to do the work, and the owner has just finished building say an un permitted deck, or some other renovation on the house, maybe it meets code, maybe it doesn't. However, the work the ho did is work that you would commonly do, as a gc you build decks all the time, you even advertise it on your sign in the front yard. Question:

What happens come inspection time? Can this cause a messy situation where the inspector or HO may try to say you did the deck, or other HO addition? Is there a way to cover yourself in say an inside remodel where the HO may do other more subtle things which blend into your renovation, and the inspector might see? IE you just installed a new guest bath to code, with permits, and the HO adds some goofy electric baseboard heater thats not to code.

Is any of this possible? Or am i just having nightmares in the daytime again? Its semi warranted, I will be posting about how I am being harassed by a building department currently, once the final result comes about.

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Originally Posted by Celtic
Like I said...I'm sure you are very good at what you do ~ whatever that is and where ever it happens.

rbsremodeling

Had an incident about 3 months ago where I did addition for some customers I am finished the job and 2 days before my final inspection HO pulls the handrails down on the existing staircase to leads to the addition to replace them himself. Inspector walks in looks around goes up the stairs checks things out and says you do really good work never thought it would come out looking like this. Walks down the steps and hands me a red sticker I am like wtf. He was like you think I would pass you with out handrails?? I was like the HO pulled them down. He was like well call me when he gets them up and I wil give you the final sticker then

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Bone Saw

I would have to say hell no, the whole point is moot, twp issued you a permit based on specs submitted, your SOW obviously doesnt contain said umpermited work, thats between the ho and twp

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Chester County Custom Decks
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Double-A

Leave my sister-in-law OUT of this please.

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"My clients’ wishes are the center of my attention." -- David Guido, a contractor in Woodstock, N.Y.
New York Times, July 20, 2006

Patrick

Yes but pretend for a second that you are a hack. You don't want to pay for a licensed plumber, so you pull a permit to do some remodels, do not include the plumbing on the permit, do the plumbing yourself and try to say it was original... Shouldn't they be on the look out for this sort of thing? Wouldn't that get us down this slippery slope as a legit contractor?

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Originally Posted by Celtic
Like I said...I'm sure you are very good at what you do ~ whatever that is and where ever it happens.

Double-A

Your contract should address existing work and other work on the property that will take place while your work is going on.

"All changes/additions/repairs to property performed by the contractor will be properly permitted as required by local AHJ. All permits will be perfected through to final inspections as required. Any work, recent or concurrent that is done on property will be disclosed to inspectors and/or AHJ.

"Client understands and acknowledges that changes/additions/repairs not performed by contractor (as outlined in exhibit A, scope of work, or amendments to this contract via duly approved change orders), may be non-compliant with local codes and accepts full financial responsibility as well as full responsibility for delays or stop-work orders that may arise from such situations, as well as all costs, including fees, fines, citations, additional permit expenses, labor, material, engineering, paperwork submittals, studies, legal representation, et al, to correct and bring such changes/repairs/additions into compliance.

"These situations are outside the control of the contractor and as such any addition costs, or delays incurred are not the responsibility of the contractor. Furthermore, client agrees to hold contractor blameless and without fault of any kind for said changes/repairs/additions, and to defend contractor against any and all such claims of responsibility."

This is off the top of my little pointed head, so it ain't much, but if you decide to use it, it may not be worth the ink to print it. Have your attorney look it over. If he likes it and uses it, have him send me some money for inspiring him.

Note the first part of that. Any work you didn't do, you're gonna blab about. Your contract now says you will. The client agrees you're going to blab about it. They also agree to defend you against any type of responsibility for that work. It looks mean and vicious, but what it really is, is fair. If your client or some clown they hired is playing fast and loose with the rules, your client agrees that it ain't your fault and they ain't gonna let no one give you grief over it.

Its a fair thing for both parties. Its just a shame anyone would need a clause like this in their contract.

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"My clients’ wishes are the center of my attention." -- David Guido, a contractor in Woodstock, N.Y.
New York Times, July 20, 2006

kevjob

We just tell the building dept we have nothing to do with the deck and let them deal with it, they will get caught when our inspector walks around to look at panel or vent termination etc..

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Kevin
Basement Finishing Highlands Ranch Colorado
Littleton Colorado, Basement Remodeling
Kitchen Remodeling Denver

HomeSealed

All that matters is what is on your contract. I WILL NOT be held responsible for anybody else's crap work, that is why I am very specific in my contracts. If an inspector happens to notice some hack work done by an HO or a hack "contractor" while inpecting my work...Tough sh!t.

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C.C.R.

If I'm doing it. Its in the contract. If there is a hack that pulls permit for one phase of a job and not another on the same job not only should he get nailed hard by the inspector but he should also get a slap in the back of the head for being so stupid.

Here in MA. you need a HIC # to pull a permit.

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Complete Custom Remodeling
"When Quality is Top Priority"
www.completecustomremodeling.com

Patrick

So the story is, we were doing windows siding doors gutters etc, We had our dumpster there which has our name plastered all over the side of it. (its the best jobsign ever) Anyways we finished up on Thursday, and for a few bucks I agreed to leave it at the house over the weekend for the customer to fill. Anyways the HO starts demoing the kitchen and bathroom, the nosey neighbors see this, and tell the city that we are doing an interior remodel with no permit!

So of course the burden of proof falls on ME not the city, and not the neighbor

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Originally Posted by Celtic
Like I said...I'm sure you are very good at what you do ~ whatever that is and where ever it happens.

C.C.R.

Is your customer denying that you only "rented" your dumpster to him for the weekend?

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Complete Custom Remodeling
"When Quality is Top Priority"
www.completecustomremodeling.com

Patrick

No, Luckily, but the city sent out the Spanish inquisition to make sure

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Originally Posted by Celtic
Like I said...I'm sure you are very good at what you do ~ whatever that is and where ever it happens.

C.C.R.

hopefully, everyone involved is honest, and this all goes away for you. nice neighbors though huh?

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Complete Custom Remodeling
"When Quality is Top Priority"
www.completecustomremodeling.com

Patrick

Apparently the neighbors grew up in the house we sided, that was moms house till she died. They told our customer they hated the new color, and have been giving them the cold shoulder ever since! Our customer cant get over it!

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Originally Posted by Celtic
Like I said...I'm sure you are very good at what you do ~ whatever that is and where ever it happens.

easy sider

It shouldnt be a problem if you have a signed contract with your scope of work. The worst that could happen is a stop work order on the interior work that your not doing anyway.
In WA its the home owners responsibility to get permits. Only a home owner or licensed contractor can get a permit.
Good Luck any way