What's Your Feelings On Permits?

dshcontracting

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dougchips

No easy answer. We pull permits for all of our jobs. What can you get charged with if you do work when you don't have the license?

Double-A

Getting charged or fined would be the least of my worries. Getting stung by a client or TV crew would.

Heck, getting to court in any kind of lawsuit would worry me if I didn't have a permit on the job. If the law or ordinance requires the permit, we pull it. I don't care if the township gets rich, and I'm not about to enter into a conspiracy with the client to commit fraud.

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"My clients’ wishes are the center of my attention." -- David Guido, a contractor in Woodstock, N.Y.
New York Times, July 20, 2006

dshcontracting

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Grumpy

I like permits and licensing and regulation... when properly enforced. When not enforced it only places more burden on the honest businessman.

There are too many hacks in our trade and the purpose of a permit and license is to help weed out the hacks and protect the consumer. Is this system fool proof? No. However when properly enforced it does help. Sometimes I think permits are just another way for the local village to pad their pockets, and in some cases I think that is true.

concretemasonry

A short thought --

If there weren't codes and permits, there would be fewer contractors, and more sloppy, poor DIY construction.

__________________
Dick

Engineer, designer and consultant recently active domestically and internationally on construction and design in about 35 countries.

joasis

No matter the justification, you are breaking the law. I agree with you 100% on pulling permits for some of the jobs you describe, but doing trade work without the license is not only illegal, how do you know you do better quality work then licensed guys? I have seen some electrical problems that baffled me, and I am pretty decent at most residential wiring....in Oklahoma, you get caught without a permit, it may cost you a few hundred dollars...you get caught wiring or plumbing without a license, and you get a citation for $425 (first offense) up to $10,000 (3rd offense) and they will make you understand thet you will quit, or they will follow you around...etc, etc...

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Grumpy

I was on a job the other day and at 9 am the inspector showed up and posted a CEASE WORK ORDER. Turns out the plumber isn't wasn't licensed, the whole project got shut down.

We were there to install 5 vents in the siding that have been plaguing us for months waiting to get paid, one imaginary problem after the other. We waited for the inspector to leave and installed our 5 vents in under and hour and hurried up out of there. I am not waiting another, who knows how long, to get paid $5000 because the customer didn't like the color of 5 vents.

Driftwood

Permit outside visual work . inside bootleg . ask customers about there neighbors , any problems may be a phone call ! Keep clean, no debreas
or materials outside ,visual.

I do permits on larger work . bootleg much . goodluck

tkle

Any system can be abused.Permits standardize the workmanship,insure some quality which makes it a lot easier to bid a job.They also keep property values of surrounding properties up.They are in place to help the community and protect the customer.They help pay for the roads and the schools needed as the population increases.Choices in exterior could possibly also be in the CC&R's when the property is bought in which case that may checked on also.Somebody has to pay for this.It should be the one doing the building.

tkle

Some call it bootleg,I call it scab.

tcleve4911

We work in the Burlington VT area.
In the city if Burlington you need inspections for zoning setbacks, footings, concrete, framing, electrical rough in & finish, plumbing rough in & finish, exterior stairs & handrails.
In South Burlington, a step across the sidewalk, no permits are required !!!! The "hack factor" is the same in either town.

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Back in Maine
Dubbin' Around
Doin' good stuff ......

thom

No matter how good you are, no matter how well you treat customers, you will run into one/some who want to screw you. To some it's a game with everyone and they're going to come out the winner by getting your work without paying.

You are going to have a much more difficult time convincing a judge/jury that you are an honest and responsible contractor and that you did a good job when, before the construction work even began, you were knowingly violating the law in order to save a few bucks.

tkle

Lack of enforcement.If they are on the books they should be enforced.Same for contractors license.prevailing wage and so forth.If they're not enforced it's not fair for the honest people,compounding the problem.

concretemasonry

It could be a the "hack factor" is not a question of the Burlington area codes and requirements or city limit locations, but maybe it is just a general problem of the concept of what is acceptable in the area.

That could explain the lack of enforcement.

__________________
Dick

Engineer, designer and consultant recently active domestically and internationally on construction and design in about 35 countries.

tcleve4911

I agree......enforcement is the name of the game. You can write all the rules & specs you want, but if they're not enforced, it's just a piece of paper.

__________________
Back in Maine
Dubbin' Around
Doin' good stuff ......

Bone Saw

PRICELESS

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Custom Decks & Carpentry LLC.
Chester County Custom Decks
Custom Deckbuilder Mainline
Philadelphia Deck Builder
Custom Decks & Carpentry on Facebook

Bone Saw

No wonder public education sux, tell me what are school district property taxes used for?

__________________
Custom Decks & Carpentry LLC.
Chester County Custom Decks
Custom Deckbuilder Mainline
Philadelphia Deck Builder
Custom Decks & Carpentry on Facebook

tcleve4911

Watched your windsurf video..awesome!!!!
Oh yeah, your work looked nice ,too.

__________________
Back in Maine
Dubbin' Around
Doin' good stuff ......

mdshunk

On the odd occasions when I'm in Lowe's or Home Depot and I see HarryHomeowner loading up his cart with rolls of Romex or boxes of pipe fittings, I have to wonder what he might be doing. I can guarantee you that if business ever fell off for me, I would not be beyond sitting in the parking lot and following some of these folks home to turn them in. There is a town about 20 miles to my north in which a large plumbing contractor pays college students to do just this very thing. Dirty pool, or guerilla trade protectionism?