What's It Take To Be A GC?

maj

Don't let the title deceive you, I don't want to be a GC.I've been watching this forum for a week or so now and have come to the conclusion that maybe the requirements for being a General Contractor are vastly different than what I always thought.

I am from a small midwest area, and there are only a handfull of actual General Contractors around here. We use them mainly for large commercial buildings or perhaps new residential developments. These companies have anywhere from 20 to 100 employees, and are in no way a threat or considered to be competition to the vast number of other contractors around here. We are two totally seperate types of business and not even considered to be on the same playing field.

Now, what I have noticed on this forum is that a few who call themselves General Contractors are really just painters,or landscapers,or carpenters,or roofers,etc. So maybe it is geographic differences, but from what I have always considered to be General Contractors seems to be different than what I see being expressed occasionally on this forum.

Don't get me wrong, I am not dissing this website or anyone who participates on it. I happen to be somewhat hooked to it already after only a week or so. I have gained some useful information and had a few laughs.

I see a post every now & then where someone is asking the most basic guestion regarding the contracting business. I would think people would do their homework and learn the trade before starting such a complicated business.I am fairly mechanically inclined but not trained or even spent much time under a hood, so I would not just go out and open an auto repair shop without learning first how to be a mechanic.

I have an acquaintance who decided to go out on his own a few years ago. Not as a GC, but just an Independent Contractor like myself.Well he wasn't doing well and decided to put a couple of 1/4 page ads in the yellow pages. One was for concrete work... He listed his company as "concrete specialists", I will tell you he is far from that!! The other ad he had written "For all your general contracting needs". He only has one other worker besides himself,and they kind of do whatever work they can get. I believe that he thinks the term "general contractor" means that he does "general type of carpentry",IOW, jack of all trades.

I wonder if the term "General Contractor" has a different meaning to different people.I would be interested in hearing the different ways some of you perceive it.I happen to think of General Contractors as companies who have alot of jobs going at once, with many employees, multi-million dollar gross sales,and subcontract the majority of the work to other trade specialists. This is just the way I perceive it, but maybe I'm wrong according to some of the things I've read here

RobertCDF

I more or less see a general contractor as anyone who either does everything related to a project or cordinates subs to do the work. So I could call myself a general contractor if I contract a deck and hire a sub to do any stucco work, another sub for any custom welding. The customer only calls me and that is why I can add a % to my subs estimates.

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Robert Shaw
Colorado Springs Custom Decks
Colorado Custom Decks
Custom Composite Decks

Mouldings&More

Patience. No you should have a good understanding of every aspect of the trade so you do not get taken advantage of.

Melissa

We're in the Los Angles area, and my husband is a GC. He went for that lic (3 yrs ago), so he could do a broad range of things, not just electrical, etc.

Sure we don't know a lot of "business" end, but we know enough to get by and stay out of trouble, and we do fairly well. We are figuring it out as we go, and you'll find me on here asking what seems to be pretty simple questions, but we're trying to better our system, and hey, everyone has to start somewhere right?

Sometimes, I think GC, is to vague. When I tell people my husband is a "contractor" seems so odd, because he's not a "paper contractor" like what some probably think of with that term.... I agree. It's weird! So I usually follow it up with he mainly does kitchen and bath remodels.

bob the builder

One call does it all with the general contractor.

logical

Around here a general contractor means the guy who either does it all or most likely coordinates dividing a job up and subbing the parts out. He is responsible for the complete job. In fact, for residential work, it is usually used interchangably with "builder". An owner-builder is refferred to as a person "acting as his own GC.

maj

That's the geographic differences I was talking about. Around here, when you here "contractor", you would think of the guy that is out in the field working his tail off with a small crew of one or two. On the other hand, the term "General Contractor", is the individual or company that only works at the office or desk and never gets his hands dirty.

I wonder, does your husband work alone, since he mainly does kitchens & baths. If so, then around here he would be just "contractor".

Then we also have our "briefcase contractors", who are single individuals who run several jobs at once, subcontracting all phases of construction. These guys usally don't get too dirty, and work out of their truck & a small office.

Melissa

He's mainly alone, has one helper and subs a few things out to make it cheaper, faster, easier on the back! On bigger jobs, he'll bring in a friend or two to help out.

joasis

One way to look at it maj, is how the word "contractor" is used...to me, it means we take on a contract to complete a task at a given price. "General Contractor", as Bob points out is a one call, do it all. I think of myself as a GC, because, I coordinate all the worksite activities, see that the subs get there when they are needed, and mediate all the problems when things aren't working right. For example, the electriciam we use wanted attic access above a specific area of a remodel, the hvac guy wants his duct work to "Y" at that point, and the plumber I am sure will want a waste vent there...now who do you think gets to figure this out, and charge the customer for the umpire service??? LOL
I have 2 employees, 2 sub contract crews, each with a few guys, one each HVAC, elec, plumber, tape, bed, and paint, a brick mason, and other guys we call as needed...only my guys and my direct sub crews work only for me, but I coordinate a lot of work, and lots of times, I get nothing for it except a major class headache.

joasis

Oh yeah...I nearly forgot and this will make most smile...a GC is expected to be like Ty Penington....my wife thinks good looking too...

I forgot to add that a GC is an impromptu draftsman, architect, home plan coordinator, designer, engineer, and general idea man. If you aren't all of these things, and have no idea how to find these guys to actually do it, then you must not be a GC.

AtlanticWBConst

I work in NH, MA and RI. In NH, it seems that anyone can call themself a GC-no licensing arrangement, RI seems to be the same (I have spoken to the RI state agency requesting that info.) In MA, you can register as a Home Improvement Contractor. This would make you a 'contractor'. However, you cannot work on commercial jobs as a 'GC' using that registration. Also, you cannot 'pull' a building permit for someone elses property, the homeowner has to.
In MA, there is a licensing arrangement. I went to school to get my unrestricted Builders license (there a several levels of licensing there). It allows me to do any and all kinds of residential and commercial work. In addition, when we obtain residential and commercial building permits, we are required to provide a 'workman's-comp' policy...which we also have (tho expensive). So in MA, to be an 'official' GC - You need to be licensed and registered. Tho....there are alot of people that 'call' themselves GC's with out these things... not trying to diss' anyone ....just listing the facts for my area.

maj

This may be why there is a big distinction between "General" & "Independent" in Iowa.There really is no requirement to be licensed. Only the $25 bi-annual registration to the division of labor.

I wished Iowa would have a licensing requirement in force, to weed out the "weekend warriors" that turned "pro".I used to think that would make the guys like me able to make a better living. But the way it looks to me, hearing the stories from you guys, that it doesn't matter if you're licensed or not, still get the underbidding/underquality contractors!

I do not consider myself a General Contractor, but comparing to evryone responding here, I most certainly am one. Most of my work, 90%,comes directly from the HO. I do all the meetings with them (usually saturdays),design & draw up the plans(including making blueprints for HO & other trades involved),line up the excavator, plumber,electrician,flooring guy,etc. I do all the construction phases of a project myself & crew. I will sometimes do drywall, tile, concrete, etc. but only if HO insists. I line up and order all materials, work with HO on deciding special order features, and even will search on web for them. I, of course, get paid for all this, but only hourly wage. If I were to charge like some of the guys on here, I wouldn't last too long. Nobody would hire me.

joasis

I don't know how you make it maj, if you do all that by the hour. I work cost plus, only when neccessary. Bidding makes sense, and I have yet to see many people breaking into the trade on an hourly market.

mikesewell

If you get an early start, work hard enough, and do all of your homework, you may become a good GC in aproximately one average life-time. Without a technical degree in construction or engineering, or quite a few years of working for large construction firms (or preferably both), the odds of becoming an effective GC in less than a few decades are pretty slim. All told, it's much easier to become a medical doctor.

I was lucky. My father was a builder. I grew up on the job site, and was the General Contractor's right hand man. I got lots of experience working in all phases of construction. I went to trade school in my teens, and then went off to study engineering.

It is very difficult, if not impossible, to get anywhere as a general contractor without at least one good mentor. Most people never figure out what it is that they're supposed to be learning. In their whole lives, most only get bits and pieces of it.

Construction is easy, it's just physics and calculus. General contracting is much more than that...

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Commercial construction

Sewell Construction

Spectatorz

This is what is Required around here in order to Be a GC according to the State License Board :

General Building Contractor

7057. (a) Except as provided in this section, a general building contractor is a contractor whose principal contracting business is in connection with any structure built, being built, or to be built, for the support, shelter, and enclosure of persons, animals, chattels, or movable property of any kind, requiring in its construction the use of at least two unrelated building trades or crafts, or to do or superintend the whole or any part thereof.

This does not include anyone who merely furnishes materials or supplies under Section 7045 without fabricating them into, or consuming them in the performance of the work of the general building contractor.

(b) A general building contractor may take a prime contract or a subcontract for a framing or carpentry project. However, a general building contractor shall not take a prime contract for any project involving trades other than framing or carpentry unless the prime contract requires at least two unrelated building trades or crafts other than framing or carpentry, or unless the general building contractor holds the appropriate license classification or subcontracts with an appropriately licensed specialty contractor to perform the work. A general building contractor shall not take a subcontract involving trades other than framing or carpentry, unless the subcontract requires at least two unrelated trades or crafts other than framing or carpentry, or unless the general building contractor holds the appropriate license classification. The general building contractor may not count framing or carpentry in calculating the two unrelated trades necessary in order for the general building contractor to be able to take a prime contract or subcontract for a project involving other trades.

(c) No general building contractor shall contract for any project that includes the "C-16" Fire Protection classification as provided for in Section 7026.12 or the "C-57" Well Drilling classification as provided for in Section 13750.5 of the Water Code, unless the general building contractor holds the specialty license, or subcontracts with the appropriately licensed specialty contractor.

(Amended by Stats. 1997, Chapter 812 (SB 857).)

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maj

This is exactly what I am refering to. And that is why I do not classify myself as a general contractor. It seems though there are many on this forum who claim to be General Contractors. I do not consider a person who likes to do remodeling, does it all himself, a General Contractor!! I know many General Contractors personally, most are 2nd or 3rd generation in the business. Like you said, they grew up on the job site, then progressed up to being the boss, but only after many years in the trenches.

I will agree it takes some education beyond high school. I started working for contractors (not General) right out of high school. Been doing it for 25 years now and would never consider being a General, for lack of knowledge & training.

mikesewell

The trick is to learn what to learn. That's why engineering school or experience with a large firm is so important.

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Commercial construction

Sewell Construction

nadonailer

Good job, Spectatorz! That's what a GC is exactly. I can't believe some states don't have licensing requirements! Jeez... I'd love to see some of that work

Basically, in order to call yourself a 'contractor', you need to be licensed. Period. If you don't have a State Contractor's License, then you are not a contractor. I've been assuming that everyone calling themselves contractors on here are actually licensed by their respective states. No?

And if you want to do a full bath or kitchen remodel, like Melissa's husband, you would need to have a GC license, because it would involve several trades (plumbing, electrical, carpentry, tile, drywall, etc...)
Over the past 20 years, California has pretty well cleaned out the scabs by increasing the penalties ($10,000 + jail time) and running sting operations. And most licensed guys won't sub to a non-licensed company (a - because they don't want to support those guys and b - because its illegal) Actually most licensed guys I know will turn in a scab.......

Specifically, though -to get a contrs. license in Cali, you must prove 4 years experience out of the past 10 in your trade(s), have a contractor sign a certification stating such, pass a fairly rigorous 4 hr. test involving both trade and law (the passing rate is less than 12% in some trades), and obtain a surety bond.

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maj

I just picked up my bill for Uncle Sam from the lawyer, and according to him (Uncle Sam) I must be doing alright

BTW.... Almost all the contractors (my direct competition)around here work T & M. Notice I didn't say General Contractors.

I will tell you I am not working paycheck to paycheck anymore, like I used to as an employee. I am now able to put away money, take vacations(and not use the credit card), and buy my kids all their necessities and more,without worrying where the money will come from.

maj

WELL EXCUUUUUUUSE ME
I guess all the SCABS in Iowa are all pieces of ********************, then aren't they.

I believe I stated before that I wish Iowa did have a licensing requirement, but I don't make the laws!!!!

So just because Iowa and a few other states do not require contractors(OOOPS, I meant SCABS) to be licensed, we do ********************ty work?!??!?