Long Time Home Builder...1st Time Fence Builder

weats

Good morning...I have built homes for 34 yrs but never any fencing. now an important customer, who will be a great source of business if this goes well, wants 400' of 8' high cedar dog eared fence. I want to treat him fairly and do a first rate job, so I would love to hear a few opinions on the matter.
Here is what I assume is the SOP for fence building; 4x4 treated posts 8' o.c. 3- 2x4 treated girts stainless nails bury the posts 48" deep, stuff some dry sakrete in there.
As far as price I read on the forums somewhere to double the materials and add 15%, I think this is about my price point to guarantee a signed contract. this formula comes to $25 per foot.
I would love some feed back on this,
Thanks and have a great day.....Weats

Stiletto

how long do you expect the treated posts to last below grade?

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BuiltByMAC

8' tall posts - yes, 4' in the ground.
I prefer to mix my concrete before dropping it in the hole around the post. For such a tall fence, I'd look at 12" min. diameter post holes.
Definitely 3 2x4 rails to secure 8' tall fence boards.
You already have a source for the fence boards? 1x6x8' tall cedar might need to be specially ordered.

As far as price, don't ask. ever. You get to figure out that one yourself.

Good luck w/ the project -

Mac

Forry

Think about upping the posts to 6x6. 4x4's change shape pretty dramatically. Not all of them, but maybe 1 in 5 will get bowed and ruin the look of the fence.

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mickeyco

8 foot tall fence, wow, I've never seen anywhere out this way that will let you build a residential fence that high. I am not a fence guy, although I have done several (always get suckered into them, and swear I'll never do another). I'd be curious to what the real fence guys think about posts with no concrete (except for gate posts), I've seen problems with the posts rotting right at the top of the concrete, last fence I did, we didn't use concrete, time will tell.






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Forry

Did my fence (6') with packed gravel. Just as good as concrete. Better in that it can drain out.

__________________
now i am scared for my future
i've got all ten
smashed a lot of them stupidly before
-john5mt

BuiltByMAC

Good call, man... will help w/ stiffness as well (8' tall is a big sail in the wind)

Mac

Stone Mountain

Mostly we do concrete as that is what is expected. Sometimes we've done packed gravel or limestone, works just as well.

-for an 8' fence, definitely use 6x6 posts. 4x4's tend to sway and warp.
-drill a 10" dia hole, 3'6" to 4' deep.
-mix and pour concrete, or use ready mix. Don't pour dry.
-no problem with rotting posts. I can drive by many houses in the city where I built the fence 25 years ago and the fence is still ok.
-3 2x4 stringers is about right. Cedar, though is a problem. It is not as good as Pressure treated in terms of rot resistance.
-400 ft of 8' high fence should take anywhere from 3-6 days to build, so price your labour accordingly.
-doubling material cost doesn't work for me. I take material, plus labour, plus concrete, plus 50% markup plus 2% for credit cards, which gives me the sale price.
-I'd be around $37-40/ft. If it's a real good customer whom I've done business with before, I might take off 5%.

These are secret prices, so don't go telling anybody, especially my competition here in Toronto. I don't want anyone to know.

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Chris G

Wooo..I'm lowering my price to $36 a foot. It's gonna be a good year.

To the OP: Not sure where you are, but that 8' on centre plan doesn't always work.
if you have rocks in the ground and you can't drill, you have to try a new spot which may leave you at 7 feet or worse, 9 feet. Best to shoot for 7' 6" oc so you're not scrambling for 8'1" lumber because your hole is out a tad.

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mickeyco

Where the hall was that advice years ago when I needed it.







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Stone Mountain

Hey CHris. What's wrong with my price? I'm just guestimating it here. I have learned over the years not to give my stuff away.

And you're right about spacing. We always work it out to 7'10" spacing or less.
Where our new guy lives though, there's prolly no rocks or stuff in the ground!! (LOL)

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weats

Thanks for the feed back folks. I will take your advice and tighten up the post spacing to stiffen the fence and allow for rocks. I always order extra posts anyway so I can ****can the rocking chair pieces. I think a siding nailer with stainless ringshanks is the way to go.
Thanks again and have a great day.
Off to build America one nail at a time........

Chris G

I was kidding. It was an attempt to undercut you and take all your business. I don't do enough fences to even know what I charge per foot.

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Deck Fence Porch Builder Toronto

Stone Mountain

I pretty much got that. However, with email, you lose the speech inflections and body language to know for sure, Chris.

On a more serious note: there are hundreds of fence and/or deck companies in the city, plus even more hacks doing it on the side. Guys like you (and hopefully me) will survive because you do solid work and have a good reputation.

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BattleRidge

$40 a foot is pretty standard here with a 6 ft fence.