Getting High...

Robie

Okay, got your attention.
I read a lot on this forum about charging extra for doing work at heights. I am in the middle of doing some repair to an old Victorian and the sofit, facia and crown had to be replaced. I would guess it's 25' above the ground. A friend of mine is helping me (the ladder guy...I'm the ground supervisor). The work has been pretty straight-forward, but the height does make it more difficult.
Just wondering what your thoughts are as to an increased charge.
Thanks.

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Glasshousebltr

100 bucks an oz.

Bob

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Bob

Cole

Are you asking for a price?

I always increase the price if height is an issue.

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River Rat Dad

I would build in to the estimate for unique situations where feasible.

Currently I am doing a roof job on a 10/12 pitch. The roof I am replacing is only 13 years old. The previous guys replaced several sheets of ply 13 years ago but left the hard ones undone. Several sheets run in to valleys. I am loosening jack rafters and the 1X6 they lay on. Its a mighty slow process. My per sheet price doesn't take this in to account. Sure wish it did....

theworx

Great question. I did a job a fews years ago where all the ceilings were 12', 14, up to 22' high. With my little brain I doubled my normal price for boarding, taping and painting)... I lost my shirt with the extra help required and the slower pace that scaffolding work required. I too am curious as to what others charge for having to work at higher than normal heights???

jmic

You can look at this a couple of different ways.
1) You are more at risk of injury so I would charge a premium.
2) If you're working by the hr. the people are paying more anyways cause it's taking you longer to do work because of height.
3) If you bid the job and doing it with a contract you deffinitly should have figured a premium
Just my thoughts.

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Joe

River Rat Dad

I remember the good old days when an OZ was 12 bucks

Sparky Joe

I would imagine the increased price is due to having to rent a lift? And not necessarily just a "pucker" fee

karma_carpentry

People don't levitate. If a higher percentage of the work is out of reach, the work takes longer. A 40' ladder is a hell of a lot more work to handle than a 24' ladder. A harness may be a safety necessity, but it slows you down a bit. A claim on your workman's comp can raise your future rates dramatically.

All of these factors are real cost increases, not just a 'pucker' factor. Don't be afraid to figure in extra for height. If you don't you'll be sorry.

pwrpapa

I remember those days. LOL

Grumpy

The answer is always "As much as you think you can get."

The higher the job, the higher the price. First off, from a roofing point of view, saftey rule change. Also it takes longer to climb up and down the ladder. When I work at those heights, and a strong wind were to blow I'd stop for a moment to let it subsude, so what ever work I am doing takes longer to do.

But go back to my original answer, the answer is always "as much as you think you can get."

Mike Finley

Unless you have already discussed the height issue and that you charge extra for work up high with the customer I would find it dishonest and dishonorable to now be springing an extra charge on a customer. We do no workie without the customer knowing exactly what is coming with it. Customers don't appreciate being told after the work is done they owe more than they thought they would. My job as a professional is to keep the customers aware of what is happening and get their approvals before extra charges are incurred. Because we do it that way there is never a problem when the invoice is handed to them, they remain happy as clams and you get a quick and easy check and a customer who will feel he was treated fairly.

Grumpy

Yeah I agree with Mike. I was under the assumption, that you were still bidding or just asking in general terms. I try to never spring suprises on the customers and if I messed up a bid that's my problem.

This is why charging by the piece will get ya' into alot of trouble unless ya' know what ya' are really really doing and adjust the piece rate based on difficulty.

Mike Finley

I think a lot of guys just missed the

Grumpy

Yeah I missed it for sure. Ya know so many words, so little time... I usually just skim, unless something really grabs my attention.

Robie

There has been no disonesty or underhanded business practices. I took this job on, on a time and materials bases and I'm glad I did, because of the height and old house issue.
The home-owner wants to pay me weekly, so when I got this weeks statement together, labor seemed a little high for the task at hand. But, with 4 ladders going at any given time, rain delays (stopping to put away every tool I dragged out, install tar paper over areas), it seemed reasonable.
Just asking for future reference. If you have to climb a ladder, do you charge more.

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If you have integrity, nothing else matters. If you don't have integrity, nothing else matters. ~Alan Simpson

Glasshousebltr

Not only do I remember them, but I think that's about the last time I burnt one down.

I get my current price threw simple drug inflation economics.

Bob

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Mike Finley

Well, if it's time and materials didn't you quote them a per hour charge? How can you change it from $60 an hour now to $70 an hour just because you feel it is justify able because you are climbing ladders now?

Isn't the simple solution that you are already being compensated by the extra time it is taking to complete the job?

Not trying to call bullsh!t on you Robie, but your original post asked directly if you should charge more on the job you are on right now, and now you are saying you are asking for future reference... so which is it?

If it's for future reference - charge whatever hourly you want. If you're charging for time and materials than anything that causes you to take more time (ladders going up and down them, setting up, taking down, the way it slows down your productivity) is already going to compensate you, right? More time, more hourly charges = more compensation. So the ladder work already has a built in compensation device doesn't it? The more I think about this the more irrelevant it seems. Unless you want more compensation for additonal risk to life and limb or just for the PITA factor of working on ladders, in reality you are already being compensated for the extra time the job is taking because you are charging hourly.

If you feel it still isn't enough just to get more because you are taking longer than simply up your hourly rates from $60 an hour to $70 an hour for example, call it combat pay or PITA pay or whatever you like.

But, if we are talking about changing the charges in the middle of the job then that's a no go in my book. You quoted them and gave them your hourly already, it isn't honest to change it in the middle of a job. The compromise of course would be to approach the customer after you square your current weekly billing and tell them you fu#ked yourself on this one and would like to know if they would take pity on you and let you up the hourly rate because of the ladders for the rest of the work.

Grumpy

One more thing I want to add to mikes post above, is that maybe you do need to add more hourly while working on ladders because some insurance carriers increase insurance for tall ladder work.

A landscaper buddy of mine changed his insurance policy. He is no longer insured to work on any ladders taller than 8'. He claims he is saving a ton of money this way. He ended up giving me all his gutter cleaner customers that are more than one story. I owe him lunch.

But the point I was trying to make is if there are more labor burdens for a spcific task, then yes the hourly rate should be higher as well. However if Time is the only concern, you are already being compensated for that time.

As I have said in many other threads the answer is always "as much as you can get". If you feel like you can get more, why not try to charge more? If it's something less people can do so there will be less compitition bidding, why not charge more? Simple supply and demand economics. I replaced a scupper on an 11 story hotel down town chicago. Had this been a 1 story my proposal would have been half of what I charged this hotel... but I knew this wasn't something the average Joe would tackle.

all vinyl

The home-owner wants to pay me weekly, so when I got this weeks statement together, labor seemed a little high for the task at hand.

i think what this means is your trying to justify the time spent if this is so then production always slow's down the higher you go and befor you start the job this has to be taken into consideration