Earlier Post, Closing The Doors, Please Read !!

tzzzz216

This is NOT directed to anyone in this forum, just venting here!!!! Okay class, I'm still here and i wont give into some of the jack of all trades , handymen that are not licensed or insured and charging $ 20.00 bucks an hour either get on board and get your license and insurance do craftmens type work along with a competive price, But dont under cut or do sloppy work and think your giving the consumer a great deal because your not! thier the ones who will have to pay double for your mistakes when you walk away from it ! Call and find out what it cost to get a business up in running and keep it going the hours put into it and the cost maybe you just might re think what your doing to the guy or women who is operating their business by the book with license , insurance, adverising,overhead and trying to bring home a pay check!!!!
Sorry guys!!!!! like i said just venting but they know who they are maybe they visit this site, maybe they just might get the message !!

Have A great Day, Tzzzz216

A+Carpenter

I feel your pain brother

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hatchet

It can be difficult to compete with that.. I just entered a bid for a 2 story 4800sf shop with upper level living quarters. Fairly complex plan but exterior walls were just a rectangle. My bid for exterior shell completed and all interior framing was around 92000 (there was also quite a bit of poor soil that would need to be excavated and replaced/compacted, as well as having a 3 week window to complete construction). A local competitor bid 50000.. and of course he got the job. I just laughed because it was kind of funny. My wife didn't see the humor as we lost a job .. I said that we wouldn't have to worry about him in about 4-5 months as he'll be bankrupt.

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Rich
WIT Construction Co.
Superior MT Contractor

tzzzz216

Thanks for the reminder Hatchet, time to bid on the work too, Only 3 of us feel this or are effeced by it

Double-A

We run into these types on occasion on adjacent jobs quite often. I just have to shake my head and wonder what they are thinking.

A pick-up and a toolbelt do not a businessman make. Its also takes a keen understanding of the real costs and risk involved.

One question I always ask of these frootloops is how they keep their books, but offer to guess before then can answer. My guess is usally right. They hand their checkbook and a sack of receipts to their accountant every three months.

My next question to them is, "Why is OK to pay your accountant 100 bucks and hour to sift through your business, but you only charge 20-50 an hour? Don't you think as a businessman, you deserve the same pay for your hard work?"

I never have gotten a good answer to that one yet.

GL and keep the faith. Only a good job deserves a good paycheck.

Kristina

I agree. The thing is, people who work that way, don't give a crap if the homeowner's have to pay double to clean up their mistakes. As long as they got paid and can buy beer at the end of the day, they're happy.

Sadly, that's the state of things these days. Every man (woman) for themselves and everyone else.

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Glasshousebltr

Beer!......Let's not associate beer with the maggots there tiny dancer.

Just because I'm a barbarian doesn't mean I'm a hack.

Bob

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Bob

Melissa

True- they won't stay in business long. I'd turn them in if they're unlilcensed.

DaveH

You find all kinds in this world. The fact is there is nobody on this site who has been in business very long who hasn't been thru this. There are also answers here on this site as to how this under bidding happens. People ask on here how much should they charge to do a job. They usually get some answers, but I'm sure they have already been bidding some jobs, and they are the one's who cause this problem. Everyone needs to start off somewhere somehow, but it's very dangerous to go into business blindly, especially into construction and not know how to bid properly...Heck I make a living from these people..

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A buck a foot is not an estimate! It's a crap shoot!

theworx

Double A, you ask how they do their books. Most of them don't. Most of them don't claim their earnings for tax purposes. Customers who are happy to get work done for half the price don't worry about a warranty, don't worry that the guy's not insured, and are probably too stunned to notice the difference in quality. They are just happy they got some work done for half the price...

Realistically, these are not the customers you want to work for anyway!!! They don't appreciate the value in having something done right, with the right materials, and having a warranty. You really have to appreciate a customer that has done their research and has put together a budget for what they can afford for a project and expect the range of what contractor's will quote them and pick the best contractor according to their needs. That's the point where you have to be a saleman and sell yourself and your work!!!

copusbuilder

Right on Unfortunately they are often retired from the union, or doctors and lawyers They just do not think anyone else is worth money!

Couple those guys with a large illegal immigration and you have a nearly impossible business market for young upstarts.

Very few people ever ask "who will be in my house working while my wife and daughter are in there?" Most don't care so long as the price is "CHEAP".

Heck, I was sold down the river on my brothers tile work because he found a guy that said the floor didn't need levelling? It did and he knows it now

But I won't fall for that type of business practice....oh ****..the wife says we gotta go to Walmart

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www.copusconstruction.com
www.etexasrentals.com
www.thelakevoice.com
AkA Richard Cranium

Kristina

Good point, Bob. How about "as long as they can afford CHEAP, skunk pee-tasting beer at the end of the day".?

Separate the savages from those who walk upright and drink good beer.

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karma_carpentry

I feel your pain. I just got turned down on two proposals today. The first one was a schoolteacher and just didn't have the money. But the other owns rental properties and just expects a licensed, insured carpenter to work for $20/hour! Especially in Boston where life isn't cheap. Come on...

wdwrkr75

I'm based in boston i got outbidded on a bathroom remodel my bid 12,000 including demo, plumbing,eletrical, board and plaster and me carpentry. Talking to a handyman he tells me he,s doin a br for 5,000 going to do all the work himself for gods sake thats the competition.

AtlanticWBConst

$5000.00 for a bathroom remodel!!!! HA, ha, ha

I can imagine what that's going to look like

Well, the HO gets what they pay for. Would not be surprised in about a year, when, what they call a 'bathroom' has got leaks and mold, etc. -

One of my subs took on a basement remodeling. He can barely speak english. All he knows is Drywall. So he asked me to come by and look at it for him. OMG - Was he wayyy ... in over his head!!
The HO is fortunate that we were there. Found Moisture & code problems, etc.
HO was also pulling a permit too. Alot would've flunked.
With the sub's approval, we sent 2 of our framers in to blow it out in a day and offered free consultation to the HO and the sub. for everything else. (We didn't steal it from him, we don't operate like that....we did an "even work trade" for a small job he had done for us)

(We only did it because the sub is a hardworking nice guy trying to buy a house for his family ... and..... we got an addition contract out of it - I also told him that he shouldn't be taking on job's that he doesn't have the experience to do - Someone is going to end up sueing him. )

I once saw one GC's T-shirts with their company name on it and a circle with a slash through it of a picture of a crying baby. Translation:
His Company didn't want to work for HO - complainers or HO cry-babies.

It makes me want to put a circle and a slash though the word "Handyman" and put it on all our trucks...and the slogan:
"We do it right.... the first time".

Don't tell me that any 'handyman' knows things like structural home designs and state codes.
I can't tell you how many piss-poor, hack jobs I have had to clean up...from a "I hired a 'handy-man' to do it a few years ago" - jobs.

One house we are in now has been messed with for about 50 years of 'handy people'...OMG - Everything from the chimney to the foundation is a mess and needs real repairs!!

I'm sure I could add to this venting.

The only point I can say is that....

a.) The HO can get what they deserve ..... if it's only price they are looking at.

b.) We are swamped with plenty of work.... (so if a HO gets a lower price...Good luck to them...and 'the Yankees' - hey, we are based in New England....)

c.) We do alot of commercial work too ... and no "Handy-man" can walk in and steal those.

- Last..... I just don't like seeing people paying for shoddy work. Their home is their largest and most important investment. I treat people's home like my own, people just need to realize that they should NEVER think that the lowest price is the 'right price'...... when it comes to their largest investment in their lives (Besides their children) ....That's like taking investment advice on your $200,000 or MORE Portfolio from a convenience store cashier working at 2:00 a.m. - simply because they have "handled money" all their life.
(I know that not all handy-men do shoddy work, but there's work that the majority of them are unlicensesd and unqualified to do, yet, because they see the dollar signs .....Many - lowball & jump in over their heads and do it wrong.)

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- Build Well -

karma_carpentry

Even if the bathroom looks nice and functions well, it's still illegal.
I could do a bathroom, do all the plumbing and electrical myself, pull no permits, do it on the sly, have no insurance, and give a much lower price.

Even if it looks and functions well, there's still the risk factor. Who's liable if a fly-by-night's bathroom remodel leaks on the floor below, or burns down the house with an electrical arc?

AtlanticWBConst

....Or how about the poor buyer who purchases the 'residence' a few years down the road and isn't aware of things...

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- Build Well -