Curbless Shower

 
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Old 01-21-2008, 12:50 AM   #1
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Curbless Shower


Whatis the best way to go about building a curbless shower. Existing drain, and slab is there. I have removed all else. The customer changer her mind at last minute, just as I was going to start to build the pan. I have not given her a price or even said that I would/could do it. Does the slab have to be removed, dug, formed w/ slope?
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Old 01-21-2008, 12:58 AM   #2
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Re: Curbless Shower


Check ADA spec's

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Old 01-21-2008, 01:47 AM   #3
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Re: Curbless Shower


From the codes I read when I saw a nice one in a mag. you can't do it have to have a 3/4" curb at min. All really depends on the inspector I bet you could still do it of you got the right guy. I was going to but in two drains if I did one in case the wash cloth blocked one thats as far as I got just planning.
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Old 01-21-2008, 05:54 AM   #4
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Re: Curbless Shower


I'm curious as to why she changed her mind, did she say? Was it because she's older and thinking to the future of having to use a walker or wheelchair?


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Old 01-21-2008, 10:26 AM   #5
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Re: Curbless Shower


www.tile-usa.com
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Old 01-21-2008, 10:49 AM   #6
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Re: Curbless Shower


I seen one and there was like a long drain in the doorway I guess you would call it. This way if any water were to run out it would go down that drain.
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Old 01-21-2008, 10:59 AM   #7
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Re: Curbless Shower


I've done quite a few.

The houses are slab on grade, the curbless shower is on the slab. The slab is recessed 4" at the shower location. A standard liner and mud pan are constructed with the top of the pan level with the floor.

I do these showers pretty long, usually 7' with a 36" opening on the side at the back. Water doesn't spray out. The drain is near the end shower head end wall, the control is on the side wall.

No shower door is needed. If needed a chair can be rolled into the shower quite easily. A person in a chair can adjust the water temp without getting under the water stream.
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Old 01-21-2008, 11:01 AM   #8
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Re: Curbless Shower


Topic title edited to make "Cubless shower" into "Curbless shower".
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Old 01-21-2008, 03:02 PM   #9
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Re: Curbless Shower


"P2709.1 Construction. Shower receptors shall have a finished curb threshold not less than 1 inch below the sides and back of the receptor. the curb shall be not less than 2 inches and not more than 9 inches in depth when measured from the top of the curb to the top of the drain." From the FL building code base on the international

Am I reading that wrong? I know it is possible to build them just like I can make a safe hand rail with 6" rail spacing but that is not to code either. I would love to use them but can I?
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Old 01-21-2008, 10:56 PM   #10
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Re: Curbless Shower


Yes, she is getting older. I think she said 73 right now and thinking about the future, in case walker/wheelchair. I have seen the inserts and stuff, but she is wanting a "custom shower". She wants something that looks nice for resale, and she might walk till the day she dies. Kingfisher, I understand the second part of the post, but the first is kind of fuzzy. Can you clarify?
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Old 01-22-2008, 07:22 AM   #11
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Re: Curbless Shower


I doubt Fla code means much in NM.
There IS an exception.
They are legal, they are done all of the time.
Keep checking in your local codes,
maybe call B/I?
Might even try posting in
"Ceramic and Stone" forum.
I've had a few pass inspections,
and hospitals and nursing homes
are filled with them.
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Old 01-22-2008, 07:49 AM   #12
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Re: Curbless Shower


Odd the first is fuzzy as heck because it a code quote LOL

I figured they are fine and legal but I can't find the code to support it?
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Old 01-22-2008, 10:25 PM   #13
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Re: Curbless Shower


Nice one in the 007 James Bond: Casino Royale moive (1:23 mark). Entire back wall is glass, side entrance does have a marble transition that looks about 1" above ceramic floor. Yeah, I know it's probably just a movie set, but it looks really good, clean and simple. If your like me, you notice this kind of stuff during movies also.
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Old 01-23-2008, 01:25 AM   #14
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Re: Curbless Shower


Dont worry works4me, I think we all notice that kind of stuff. Yes they are just movie sets, but it is still constructed. NM is booming with movie stuff. I tried to get into the set building, but, IT'S NOT WHAT YOU KNOW, IT'S WHO YOU KNOW, you know. So I think we have/all agrre it is doable and will pass inspection, which I will start to check on that. So I guess I will estimate removing the concrete, recessing and building the pan, and of course moving/lowering the drain height. Does that sound right?
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Old 01-23-2008, 06:06 AM   #15
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Re: Curbless Shower


Make sure that, if on sand, you're tied in to slab. A footing may be wise.
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Old 01-23-2008, 11:35 AM   #16
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Re: Curbless Shower


Best I can find so far....there ARE exceptions.

Page 1
Last Update: 12/5/2006
PLUMBING AND MECHANICAL
INTERPRETATION MANUAL
CODE: 2003 IRC DATE:CODE REF: P2709.
1
SUBJECT: Shower Threshold (1 OF 2) 12/5/2006
Question: What is the minimum height for a shower threshold according the IRC
Answer: IRC requires a threshold showers a 2” minimum height. When a shower does not have a threshold that is not 2" then the exception is to apply the ICC/ANSI A117.1 standard.
Residential construction is not required to comply with ADA/TAS requirements. However if the builder/homeowner wishes to use this standard for sizing they may do so.
P2709.1 Construction.
Shower receptors shall have a finished curb threshold not less than 1 inch (25.4 mm) below
the sides and back of the receptor. The curb shall be not less than 2 inches (51 mm) and not
more than 9 inches (229 mm) in depth when measured from the top of the curb to the top of
the drain. The finished floor shall slope uniformly toward the drain not less than one-fourth unit
vertical in 12 units horizontal (2-percent slope) nor more than 0.5 inch (12.7 mm), and floor
drains shall be flanged to provide a water-tight joint in the floor.
Exception: Showers designed to comply with ICC/ANSI A117.1.
608 Shower Compartments
608.1 General.
Accessible shower compartments shall comply with Section 608.
608.2 Size and Clearances.
608.2.1 Transfer-Type Shower Compartments.
Transfer-type shower compartments shall be 36
inches (915 mm) wide by 36 inches (915 mm)
deep inside finished dimension, measured at
the centerpoint of opposing sides, and shall
have a minimum 36 inches (915 mm) wide
entry on the face of the shower compartment.
The clearance in front of the compartment shall
be 48 inches (1220 mm) long minimum
measured from the control wall and 36 inches
(915 mm) wide minimum.
.
Fig. 608.2.1 Transfer-Type Shower Compartment 36
Page 2
PLUMBING AND MECHANICAL
Last Update: 12/5/2006
INTERPRETATION MANUAL
CODE: 2003 IRC
DATE:
CODE REF: P2709.1
SUBJECT: Shower Threshold
(2 of 2)
12/5/2006
608.2.2 Standard Roll-In-Type Shower
Compartment.
Roll-in-type shower compartments shall be
30 inches (760 mm) wide minimum by 60
inches (1525 mm) deep minimum, clear
inside dimension, measured at the center-
point of opposing sides and shall have a
minimum 60 inches (1220 mm) wide entry
on the face of the shower. A 30 inches (760
mm) wide minimum by 60 inches (1525 mm)
long minimum clearance shall be provided
adjacent to the open face of the shower
compartment. A lavatory complying with
Section 606 shall be permitted at the end of
the clear space, opposite the shower compartment side where shower controls are positioned.
608.2.3 Alternate Roll-In-Type Shower
Compartment.
Alternate roll-in shower compartments
shall be 36 inches (915 mm) wide and 60
inches (1220 mm) deep minimum. A 36
inch (915) mm) wide minimum entry shall
be provided at one end of the long side of
the compartment. The shower unit and
controls shall be mounted on the end wall
furthest from the compartment entry.
608.7 Thresholds.
Shower compartment thresholds shall be 1/2 inch (13 mm) high maximum and shall comply
with Section 303.

SIGNATURE:
Lonnie Erwin,
Chief Plumbing and Mechanical Inspector
City of Dallas
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Last edited by neolitic; 01-23-2008 at 11:37 AM.
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Old 01-23-2008, 05:24 PM   #17
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Re: Curbless Shower


Maybe you should do a bit more homework,
and talk to her again.
A transfer type shower with a fold down bench
will suit most people with aging concerns.
If the idea is to prolong non-assisted living,
most people are not wheelchair bound by normal aging.
If they have a condition requiring a chair,
they usually are going to need other help anyway.
Anyone would consider a nice shower
with a fold up bench a plus, so resale isn't a concern.
And the price/PITA factor goes down
without the slab/floor modifications.
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Old 01-24-2008, 12:07 AM   #18
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Re: Curbless Shower


Thanks neolitic, I think I am going to steer her in that direction. Yes the PITA would be much less. Plus, the more I am talking to her, she said at one point " It would be nice to have but not a nessecity"
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Last edited by ODDBALLS; 01-24-2008 at 12:10 AM. Reason: forgort something
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Old 01-24-2008, 09:11 AM   #19
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Re: Curbless Shower


While you are in there it's a good idea
to at least provide blocking for
ADA approved grab bars in shower and at stool.
If bars are not installed document them
with photos for the owner, and CC them under a drawer
or some where a future owner can find them.
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Old 10-04-2009, 12:47 PM   #20
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Re: Curbless Shower


I know this is an old post, but I have done a lot of roll in, accessible,
barrier free or curbless showers here in Florida.

more older folks are going this route and especially for a handicap child.

here are a couple I did and my Blog about them.

Accessible Shower - An Unexpected Gift.....

Barrier Free - Accessible - Curbless - Roll In Shower.........




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