No Service Magic

silvertree

I never heard so many people, and I mean people I know personally say so many bad things about a company. SM will get to say their piece on CT and as Americans they do deserve the right to defend themselves whether we like it or not.

In regards to the current state of affairs I am still waiting for more SM defenders to speak up. We have had the Handyman and the countertop guy Kowboy plus a few others, plus their rep who has posted with us on this thread. I have no beef with the happy customers and the SM guy.

On another note I do have recent experience with EC.com and RR.com and I can't figure out why they aren't in litigation or even jail. CF.com in California is not making 2 of their customers happy (guys I know), and my friends claim CF.com is no better than the others. I can't verify this.

And 1 other company located in Canada I have had a listing with for almost 3 years, they cashed my credit card for future billings (to be billed every 3 months) 11 days after I signed. $999.00 to be billed over the year became 3 payments in less than 2 weeks. Amount of leads in 3 years, 0.
I still have a listing on their site. I did agree to the contract, but I did not agree to paying all at once. 0 leads in 3 years.

Once again, I will never give a card number to any LGS. They (the LGS) may be trying to change things and because I know some people will get value from this I hope it works out.

__________________
Vote for Pedro
Kitchen, bath, St Paul remodeling
Minneapolis Remodel Blog
203K Loan Consultant Minnesota

Bidity

Silvertree,

I don't think that the lead generation companies can change. They've been around since the beginning of the internet, and are still doing business the same way they once were. I'm designing a site from the ground up, and I've been reading all of the contractor's comments on CT for a long time. I don't think lead generation is the right way to do business; its all volume-based. The more volume you get, the more customers you have, the bigger profit you make. But real business isn't about this. Its about the personal relationship between the contractor and their customer. That's what really counts, and thats what servicemagic and other LGS ignore 100% so they can exploit the lack of information on the internet.

I know business can be done better, in a radically different way. In a way that takes away the focus on pure volume of leads and puts the focus directly on enhancing that relationship. And, thanks to the system I've designed, I know it can work out for every party involved. Customer, Contractor, and the service.

ServiceMagic is now owned by IAC, and they're interested in one thing. Being a profit-making machine. It's time for a different way to do business, altogether. I'll keep you updated.

ModernStyle

I dont know ..... there is something to be said for profits

__________________
http://InDemandPainting.com http://www.SupermanOfPainting.com http://www.AplusPaintingServices.com

Bidity

That's the great thing. The potential system makes more money for the system then servicemagic. But this system assures that the contractor only pays when the customer selects them for a job. That way, the amount that is paid per job is more, but the contractor is paying for getting the customer, not just paying for a lead.

Seriously. It all works out. I'm gonna post another thread soon asking for improvements.

Jmfocus

Your kidding! Right?

THEHANDYMAN

.

Try taking that personal relationship to the GROCERY STORE and pay for your groceries with that. You don't need to be a BRAIN SURGEON to know that, You have to have the customers first then the relationship comes around later. Thanks to SM I am building a real good customer base and it continues to grow each day/week/month. I don't care where the jobs come from, I not to proud to pay for them at least this way I can afford to pay for them, I am just happy to have them. Without the leads generated by SM I would have been sunk a long time ago. Newspaper sure isn't the way to go, and yellow pages is a real gamble who knows how that will work out? I didn't have the money to throw away trying what might work or what might not work for me. I got the free sign up and it sounded like some thing that would work for me and it was gamble that paid big time to me.

Bragging about not signing up, reminds me of the small town that we used to live in a couple years ago. Wally World wanted to build a store in town, the town know it alls raised HELL they weren't going to have that terrible company in our town. The vote was taken and sure enough the nay sayers won (SORT OF) Wally World was turned down, they couldn't build in our town. We have 6 WALLY WORLDS within 15 miles in most any direction. The cities that have them reap great tax returns from them stores. I would like to know how many from our wise town shop there and spend their money in another town. I told the wife that they won't beat WW, they will just build outside of city limits. Well sure enough not just outside city limits but less than 5 miles away in a town that has a population of 175 ppl.

Guess who got down on their knees and begged WW to come build two years later? YUP you guessed it, the land was cleared last winter. But WW has put building plans on hold. Mean while that town of 175 are reaping in the profits from the biggest store in town. YES SIR the town showed them who was boss!

THEHANDYMAN

I see that part about the bad leads refund, this is shot of my e-mail from last few days. As you see there is 3 refunds that were approved had sent in less than a week ago not 6 months ago. Also had a couple more that were approved. Had one that was on the edge that got denied but I gave it a shot it was stretch.

THEHANDYMAN

I have this pic saved that has to be a favorite of mine, here is the story behind it.


While suturing a cut on the hand of a 75 year old Texas rancher, whose hand was caught in a gate while working cattle, the doctor struck up a conversation with the old man. Eventually the topic got around to Obama and his bid to be our President.

The old rancher said, 'Well, ya know, Obama is a 'post turtle'.'

Not being familiar with the term, the doctor asked him what a 'post turtle' was. The old rancher said, 'When you're driving down a country road and you come across a fence post with a turtle balanced on top, that's a 'post turtle'.'

The old rancher saw a puzzled look on the doctor's face, so he continued to explain. 'You know he didn't get up there by himself, he doesn't belong up there, he doesn't know what to do while he is up there, and you just wonder what kind of a dumb a** put him up there to begin with.'


"One man gathers what another man spills"

Mike Finley

Praising Wal-mart ?

Bidity

Handyman, I'm glad to see that your business has had success with servicemagic. The lead generation model does work on a smaller scale. But let's take the useless methods out of the conversation. Directory services are no longer relevant. Newspapers are dying. I'm going to take Mike's quote out of context here:

Mike was talking about traditional advertising, and using a 'marketing mix' to build business and clients into building a successful referral base.

The business model i'm proposing is ingeniously simple, but it revolves specifically around Mike's last sentence. Historically, he is correct. Word of Mouth has never been a factor in advertising costs for businesses, because you cant put a cost on it; you cant control it.

However, The internet has changed. It's time to fix the way that contractors, local service providers and consumers do business online. I can't promise that it will be easy, but I promise that what I'm trying to do is better for everyone, like it should be. THEHANDYMAN, you should not have to have a 10% closing rate on your leads (This is the closing rate SM advertises). You yourself admit that you are not proud to do it, but it is necessary. This shouldn't be the case. We can find a winning solution for everyone. I'm working on it.


...And as far as the refunds go...wouldn't you rather be fishing then spending your time chasing money that you should already have in your pocket anyway? I know I would.

THEHANDYMAN

Fishing and not having any money vs fishing and waiting on money? Kind of like crapping in one hand and wishing in the other, which will get full first?

Stevelsc8721

Sign me up when its ready or email for advise

Jmfocus

I don't see the gripe people have with this model. If you track any form of advertising then you should know how much each lead cost based on the math. Average it out for the month, season, year, etc. If you know these numbers, then you can make an educated decision on whether SM pricing works for you or not. Its that simple. No matter what form of advertising you use, there will always be crappy leads. Some forms more so than others so you need to weigh the difference.

Many people seem to be driven by "knee jerk" emotion on this subject. Its like people take it personally that SM exists. I don't get it!!!

Does anybody actually call the yellow pages for a partial refund when a tire kicker calls? C'mon!

Do people really think SM is some sort of conspiracy? Are they really out to rip people off?

MyLar1040

This has been done and tryed before by many lead companies, and Is nothing new. I believe SM even did a small test trying your system with a select few contractors years back.

It fails miserably everytime. For many reasons

The current model works extremly well for closers and people willing to work within the system, hence SM's massive success.

One looks at their directory will tell you that two of the largest home improvement companies on the planet we call Earth use SM, and there is a simple reason for it.

If there is an opportunity to get a job they want a shot at it.
So if someone clicks somewhere in one of these search engine they want that contact and a chance to get that customer.

On another note:
If your a guy who says I only do full bathroom/kitchen remodels 20k plus and the customer should be waiting for me with his check book, and laying on his back with his legs in the air.

Buying Leads Is Not For You..

Most will have hard time with anything other then your own little website that generates 200 hits a month and 10 leads or so.

Call any other advertising method anywhere and ask them for a credit. Listen for the laughs. These lead services are the only media that does credit.

mousie177

I recently submitted a request through SM... I am shocked to say I only had one contractor contact me. So when SM sent me an email that said they matched me to three I called the other two since SM gave me their contact information...well when I called they told me they thought i was "bogus" when I assured them I wasnt they apologized... however! Because of the lack of follow up on their part they lost my business and all the word of mouth I was also searching for. We just did a remodel valued at 40,000 bucks... I can say that SM works for me! I was able to decide for myself with who was worth our project and who wasnt Sm merely did their homework and did the screening they promised me. I came on this site merely cause i wanted additional information about companies that I thought I could get here but to the looks of it you are not very professional at all and you expect to land business... with out Homeowners you would not be in business at all... so to me if we as homeowners like SM then you should too... I was a valid request... but two people didnt even give it a shot... so they missed mine and our neighbors remodels... I believe that if you are looking for someone to do all your work there is no service like that... cause as a Homeowner you should try to at least sell your own service as only you know what your company has to offer.

Kuba

Lately i keep getting hang ups from Service Magic... Im about to become the devil if it happens again..

SMsupport

Kuba, I apologize for the inconvenience. I searched our database according to your company name and wasn’t able to find it. Please feel free to contact me directly with more info about your company and I’ll make sure the calls stop.

Thanks,

Shawn Trammell
strammell@servicemagic.com

DavidC

You are right in that we need to track all forms of advertising and lead costs. Others may disagree here but to my thinking, when we buy leads we are not advertising.

The lead service is doing the advertising and selling the results. Supposedly we are purchasing bonafide leads that have been qualified. When you buy the lead and the people won't return messages or state that they aren't interested (no need to restate the whole list) then we are buying an empty egg carton that sold as a full dozen.

There are a number of consumer complaints that also indicate the lead services are possibly not screening the contractors that well either.

The business model is based on volume and they have the volume to continue profitably in spite of the naysayers.

When we actually advertise (yellow pages and other arenas) we are attempting to bring in leads, which we then qualify and weed out the bogus on our own. The money is spent regardless of any number of leads or even none. There is no basis for a refund because we weren't promised specific results.

In my mind anyway there is a big difference between advertising and purchasing leads, they are not the same.

Good Luck
Dave

__________________
www.CookContractingLLC.com

Kuba

I traced the calls back to Denver CO. I got an answering machine.. Someone Named Julie with Service magic.. I never signed up for SM, I inquired a long time ago, but didnt use them. Ive had 3 call hang ups now, i then call the number back and the person wont answer, then i get the machine (So and So with Service Magic blah blah blah(

ARI001

This site is for professionals not home owners or diyers.

Since you're here I'll share with you a little information about Service Magic. They charge different amounts for different leads. The higher the potential cost of the job the more they charge for the lead. They tell you this up front. They also tell you that they call and screen all the leads to verify they are legit. They don't. They also tell you if the contact information is bogus they will credit back the amount. Well sometimes they do and sometimes they don't. To get them to even consider doing this you have to sit on the phone for 30 minutes or longer. Time is money you know.

Another problem with SM is a lot of home owners use it to price shop because their curious what the job would cost. They are not really interested in having work done but waste our time anyway. Then there are those that want more complicated jobs done like additions. They fill out the form saying ready for bid. We get there and ask for a set of plans and get the deer in the headlight look and say they thought we would take care of that(Note that SM does have a section for designers and architects). More wasted time and again time is money.

The companies that complain about them probably wouldn't do so if SM didn't promise more than they can deliver. It's kind of like if I was to tell you I'm going to install granite counter tops in your kitchen and you come home to find Formica that looks like granite.

That said as far as lead generation services go they are no worse or better than any of the others out there. They do also screen contractors pretty well which some of the others do not do. I use them on occasion when looking for subs out of my usual work area. I use them for the convenience factor in that they have pre-screened the contractors for me. Though I still require proof of insurance and a copy of a valid license before they set foot on a job site. So I understand why as a homeowner you would like them.

As far as the professionalism of the contractors at this site it is like everywhere else. Some are and some are not. This is a cut throat business and people that are in it get frustrated especially with home owners who look down on them, try to take them for a ride, don't pay on time or at all in some cases, and don't respect the work they do and the knowledge required to do so. With out someone to build your home where would you live? With out someone to fix your broken pipe, faulty electrical duplex, or reframe your roof after that tree came crashing through it what would you do? You would have to do it yourself and then you would understand 1/2 of the issues we have to deal with. You still would have no understanding od the business side and what it takes to make it in this industry.

Remember that some of the same contractors that frequent this site also frequent it's sister site to assist home owners and diyer's. So we can't all be that bad. This is place we can share ideas with each other, get help or advice when needed, argue (sometimes for no other reason than to argue) with each other, and vent about various things that only our peers really can relate to. So in closing if you don't like what you read here then don't come back. Unless you are going to become a legit construction proffesional posts your thoughts, questions, ideas, and whatever else on the sister site. Oh, and lighten up bit.