Time To Buy A Flooring Nailer, Yipee!!! Recommendations?

moorewarner

I hear ya man, I really do, but I went into Harbor Freight recently for the first time and I gotta tell ya; there was no soul in those tools, no craftsmanship.

I find it a little ironic that folks who would think of/call themselves craftsman and go on and on about hacks and lowballers will cheap out on tools (this is not to you per se, it's more to the idea of cheap tools).

I want to do craftsman level work and I want my tools made by folks striving for the same thing.

I have no more desire to buy my tools based on cheapest price than I care to do work based on cheapest price.

I want the best tools, at the best price.

You can keep Harbor Freight.

__________________
"If you don't have time to do it right, when are you going to have time to do it over?" ~ Wise Old Timer

PrestigeR&D

So why the cleats and not staples~ ? I have the Bostitch with the roller assembly guide ~ staples..it's a great flooring nailer IMO- never had any issues what so ever. But why were you after the cleat nailer? I have heard opinions all over the board on this one~ what say you?
Brian

BCConstruction

I was having the same problem with choosing a nailer for some hickory 3/4 flooring. My paslode finish nailer was having an issue just sinking 1-1/2 finish nails through the stuff so I needed something powerful. Ended up finding out that shaw recommended staples over any other method. I even called the customer service line to confirm this and they also recommended the staples over cleats even thought cleats could be used. I had already purchased the bostitch so this was good to know. So far it's been great. Running it at 92PSI and I'm having zero issues with splitting the tounge and they are sinking perfect each time. Not a bad tool at all for $300. The primatech's do like nice though.

__________________

moorewarner

Brian,

I would love to give you my extremely scientific list of reasons why... but I will just give you this one instead.

1) I have all my flooring experience on cleats.

2) Recommendations of others toward cleats.

3) Cautioning by some of staples on a hardwood like hickory, as well as a vague opinion at the flooring tool shop that installers were using 18 gauge cleat and staples on thinner stock (though I did read one recommendation for 18 gauge cleat on hickory to reduce tongue splitting). Essentially echoes of Matt's opinion on the previous page.

4) nobody has said to me in any conversations "hey man get a stapler, it's the way to go", though others have said that about cleats.

You are actually the first person I have heard from that has said they run primarily/all staples. So what do you like about it, why do you choose staples? Run into any probs with thicker stock or harder woods?

Inquiring minds want to know.

__________________
"If you don't have time to do it right, when are you going to have time to do it over?" ~ Wise Old Timer

moorewarner

Which Bostich you runnin'? And you to Brian, which Bostich you runnin'?

__________________
"If you don't have time to do it right, when are you going to have time to do it over?" ~ Wise Old Timer

mattsk8

I currently have the Bostitch model MIII and the Primatech model P210W (I couldn't swing the really good Primatech, though it is a pretty awesome tool!).

Like I was saying, I have no complaints about my Bostitch as a tool. The problem I ran into was first on a Brazilian Cherry floor. It kept cracking the tongues and more importantly breaking them at a lot of the ends. When I purchased this floor, the company didn't say anything to me about whether to use nails or staples. After I finished it, through many frustrations and pulled up boards and yada yada, I found out cleat nails were the recommended fastener for Brazilian cherry. I muscled my way through the 5" cherry w/ the stapler but swore never again.

The next floor I ran into a problem w/ it was actually a hickory floor. Didn't break as bad as the Brazilian cherry but still would crack some and break off a few of the tongues at the ends. After I started this floor I went shopping and found the Primatech and used it to finish it.

Ever since these experiences I've come to love my Primatech, it's the only one I've used since I bought it. I should probably just sell the Bostitch but I have a wierd love for this tool gun cuz it was my first flooring nailer!

My logic for recommending one is this, I know plenty of manufacturers that won't guarantee it if you use staples (all on very hard, dense wood), but none that won't if you use cleat nails. If you're going to have one flooring nailer, based on this, I definitely recommend the cleat nailer over the stapler. If I'm wrong on the warranty and there is one that won't guarantee it because you used cleat nails, please correct me.

That being said, I believe on a softer wood floor such as pine the stapler would be less likely to produce squeaks as I believe it holds a bit better. But that's just my opinion and the cleat nailer would still work just fine here as well.

Additionally, I would recommend the Primatech over any of the others that I've used simply because it's a much better tool; well worth the additional expense. My Bostitch was I think around 550$ whereas the Primatech is more like 800$. The Primatech takes a lot less force from your hammer swing to fire which is very nice when you're doing your last couple runs. You can get at least one more row of 5" w/ the Primatech verses the Bostitch, and at least 2 more of 2 1/2" w/ it.

mattsk8

Just out of curiosity, what's the rollor assembly guide?

moorewarner

Here is my answer.

The "R" in that Primatech 250 ALR stands for roller. The few floors I have done one of the things slowing down the process was the lift/drag and then reset on the face/tongue. I'm sure that gets faster with practice, but why not eliminate it completely?

It is like the tip I got in my previous flooring thread, to put my miter on the ground and scoot it along with flooring. I smacked myself in the head, how many times did I walk to that saw, slowing me down. How many seconds did I spend re-seating the nailer, row after row after row.

For a hundred bucks more, if it shaves 10% off of my time it will be paid for before jobs end.

Plus I am a lazy bastard.

Oooops, you said what not why...

here is the what,

+ YouTube Video

Attached Images

 

__________________
"If you don't have time to do it right, when are you going to have time to do it over?" ~ Wise Old Timer

pinwheel

I can see that roller deal being handy on big, long runs, but also see it being a pain in tight spaces like closets and entry ways. I think the cons outway the pluses in residential work like I do.

prestige, for you question about staples vs cleats. Have ya ever pulled a glue coated nail that's been in for a while? Ever pulled a ring shank that's been in for a while? Over time & season of expansion & contraction, slick sided nails will losse their bite, where as a ring shank will better retain it's bite. Cleats have ridges like ring shank nails, they'll hold better over the long haul

PrestigeR&D

I do not do a lot of flooring guys.. maybe 2-3 a year-if that but I have heard good & bad about both the staples & cleats. Funny how you get opinions all over the place.

I have put down Cherry,Maple,Red-oak, and the like- but NOT hickory or exotic woods- this I was told will not take staples- cleats only, but never had any major issues with the gun or the staples- I have a client that I became pretty good friends with and I installed white oak in his dinning room & living room using the staples and the installation went very well-and at that time I rented the Bostich.... looks as good as the day I put it in and he has been really happy with the job.

When I was getting my pneumatic floor nailer, that was the toss- cleats or staples. The rep told me that most guys were getting the staples because they had less issues with installation on NON exotic HW. I am sure I can find information about both and have~ but like I said it's all over the board.


I was just curious why some of you chose the cleats over the staples & vice versa. To be honest- I wish I would have gone with the cleat nailer because if I get a call for an exotic- I am pretty much looking at renting the cleat nailer- I just don't get a lot of HW flooring work.

Brian

Attached Thumbnails

 

Attached Images

  

mattsk8

Very true about the cleat's holding power. Just shoot a cleat then a staple and come back in two days and pull them both out. The staple will come easier. Earlier I said what I said about the softer wood being less 'creaky' w/ a staple only because the staple is wider.

I only use the Primatech cleats. I want to try the Akazuki cleats but I'm afraid ! They're a little cheaper and I can't find the 5000 ct boxes of Primatech cleats anymore so I'm stuck using 1000 ct boxes.

If you don't do exotics the staples are fine. I've had a lot of brazilian whatever's lately though so the cleat nailers been a blessing and since it works fine on the others as well I think that's the way to go. I don't do a ton of flooring either, probably even less than you Brian. Maybe 4- 6 jobs a year ish. This years actually been the exception to that though, done quite a bit of it for whatever reason.

I have the same Bostitch as you do Brian. Holy huge pad batman! I think it boils down to what you're used to here. Never had a problem w/ the original pad on mine except the one time w/ the screws that hold the pad to the Primatech. That could have been a major disaster! Thank God I caught it before it was!

moorewarner

Ya know, can't say I actually considered there being a downside...

Sure hope you're wrong on this one.

__________________
"If you don't have time to do it right, when are you going to have time to do it over?" ~ Wise Old Timer

fast fred

bostich stapler, don't know what model it is, it's sitting at a job waiting to do some repair work on a floor

it was somewhere around 400 - 500 bucks 3 or 4 years ago

has a changable base so I can nail 5/8 or 3/4 floor, and its also replace-able if you scratch it up or get glue on it

used it on everything from oak, cherry, tiger wood, bamboo, hickory, the worse was cypress, I would probably have gone with a nail instead of a staple on that junk

I like it, works like a charm

thought about the power nail brand, but they were too pricey for the amount of flooring a do a year.

used a porter cable nailer years ago before I bought mine, for some reason I just liked the bostich better. couldn't tell you why, that was five years ago

CutEdgeDesign

Always been a Senco man myself. From framing to flooring and trim they seem to hold up well.

eXpatRioteX

I have 2 of the harbor freight nailers, a blue one and an orange one. $260 for the pair, shoots cleats AND staples, and about 10,000 sqft installed with each. They paid for themselves on the first job, and 2 people nailing is better than 1. Granted some of their tools are complete junk, but so are some tools at the orange and blue boxes.

You can do quality work with cheap tools, but expensive tools wont give you quality work if you dont have the skills or experience.

Save a few buxs on the nailers and put the difference into good blades, a knock off fein, a flooring ratchet, ect.

You can always upgrade later if you feel that it will give you a better product, and recoup your cost by selling your used tool on craigslist, but i wouldn't do it personally.

Tools are a depreciating asset and a wear item. Part of smart business is cost benefit analysis.


Amazon has good prices on name brand nailers. Good luck with your decision.

Scribbles

I have the harbor freight stapler as well, I won’t use it on exotics, but I have installed bout 15k sq of oak, lupus, cherry, alder, and pine with it, no problems or warranty issues with 2" staples. Keep it oiled, keep it clean and it works, I was planning on replacing it after 1 job but I am so happy with it I don’t see why, got it on sale for 99$

__________________
http://sacramentomillworks.com