Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile

 
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Old 02-10-2011, 08:28 AM   #1
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Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Looking for opinions/feedback on VCT commercial tile comparision between Tarkett & Armstrong. Quality, value for price, spec comparison, after install issues, etc. Is one better than the other? Thanks. Gary

Last edited by gwtusa; 02-10-2011 at 08:34 AM.
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Old 02-10-2011, 05:59 PM   #2
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Personally I prefer Tarkett Azrock. It is a bit more flexible cold and better gauged in my experiences.

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Old 02-11-2011, 06:56 AM   #3
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


As is normally the case with Armstrong, anything they say about their product is hype to drive the price up. Armstrong is generally the most expensive VCT I can get for no real reason. We use a lot of Azrock and lately a lot of Mannington, which is the best price point here. One big thing to look out for with Armstrong is the spread rate on their adhesive. They say it goes further so it's actually cheaper than other thinspred. I've never found this to be the case. If you put it down with the same notch trowel how is it suppose to go further?
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Old 02-12-2011, 02:42 PM   #4
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by PrecisionFloors
Personally I prefer Tarkett Azrock. It is a bit more flexible cold and better gauged in my experiences.
Agreed....find the armstrong has more often than not a ,"banana"type edge from batch to batch....also use a lot of flextile vct not bad either..
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Old 02-12-2011, 07:01 PM   #5
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by gwtusa View Post
Looking for opinions/feedback on VCT commercial tile comparision between Tarkett & Armstrong. Quality, value for price, spec comparison, after install issues, etc. Is one better than the other? Thanks. Gary
*********************
Armstrong has by far the best quality control on commercial VCT. Nothing else comes close in my experience.
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Old 02-13-2011, 12:00 PM   #6
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


I've never had a quality issue with VCT from Azrock or Mannington. Armstrong and Azrock are made in the same factory in some parts of the country.
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Old 02-15-2011, 08:39 PM   #7
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by gideond
I've never had a quality issue with VCT from Azrock or Mannington. Armstrong and Azrock are made in the same factory in some parts of the country.
My bad we use armstrong on one of our commercial contracts a few times a month,, I misspoke by saying armstrong had the banana edges....was a different supplier all together...
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Old 02-15-2011, 11:36 PM   #8
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


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Originally Posted by gideond View Post
I've never had a quality issue with VCT from Azrock or Mannington. Armstrong and Azrock are made in the same factory in some parts of the country.
*************************'
I don't believe that's an accurate claim.

Can you back that up with any sources?
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Old 02-16-2011, 06:57 AM   #9
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Just going by what the Azrock rep has told me. It's not in all parts of the country but in the southwest there has been a plant for some time that rolls out both Azrock and Armstrong VCT. Each to it's own spec but the same production and quality control. Besides that, Armstrong has flat out lied about their what their product can do compared to any other VCT to get onto the spec at a local school system here. I'm not too fond of them after that. I'm in the process of removing most of my Armstrong displays in the store. Their business model stinks.
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Old 02-16-2011, 09:20 AM   #10
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by Groutface

My bad we use armstrong on one of our commercial contracts a few times a month,, I misspoke by saying armstrong had the banana edges....was a different supplier all together...
The bad vct is named Amtico we have had a couple jobs go bad in a college and a chuch......looks like armstrong......I'm retarded
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Old 02-16-2011, 10:18 PM   #11
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by gideond View Post
Just going by what the Azrock rep has told me. It's not in all parts of the country but in the southwest there has been a plant for some time that rolls out both Azrock and Armstrong VCT. Each to it's own spec but the same production and quality control. Besides that, Armstrong has flat out lied about their what their product can do compared to any other VCT to get onto the spec at a local school system here. I'm not too fond of them after that. I'm in the process of removing most of my Armstrong displays in the store. Their business model stinks.
***********************************
I'm calling BS on your assertion that Armstrong and Azrock share qualtity control and manufacturing facilities.

I'm a commercial flooring installer with a lifetime of experience handling VCT.

Azrock sucks

Armstrong rules.
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Old 02-16-2011, 10:30 PM   #12
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


On commercial jobs I can't recall anything but Armstrong being spec'd out. Maybe just a West Coast thing. Never had any problems with Armstrong.
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Old 02-17-2011, 06:53 AM   #13
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Call BS all you want. Doesn't matter to me. I've never had any major issues with any VCT except the stuff made by amtico, which for us was not truly square. We've installed a ton of VCT as well over the past 30 years.
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Old 02-23-2011, 10:45 PM   #14
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by gideond View Post
Call BS all you want. Doesn't matter to me. I've never had any major issues with any VCT except the stuff made by amtico, which for us was not truly square. We've installed a ton of VCT as well over the past 30 years.
******************************

I contacted the Armstrong tech department. Armstrong does not share facilities or quality control with any of their competition.

I doubt anyone who personally lays VCT on a large scale could possible be confused about the quality differences between brands. That's a misunderstanding that only happens with the people involved in the project who don't actually take the tiles out of the box and put them on the floor. It should all look good from standing position, even better from back in the office at the shop. But to make the floor look good takes a lot of extra time and effort when the tiles are of inconsistent size, shape and shade. Real "tile jockeys" will all know what I'm talking about.

Azrock and Tarkett are likely made in the same factory. Probably that's what you were told.

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Old 02-24-2011, 06:59 AM   #15
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Azrock and Tarkett are the same company. Of course they'd often be made in the same plant. 90% of the VCT we sell and install is Azrock. No issues with size, shape or shade. Someone has fallen victim to Armstrong's brainwashing again.
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Old 01-21-2012, 08:59 AM   #16
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


One of my clients has Armstrong Imperial Texture Standard Excelon VCT in a busy doctor's office. Building was built in 2003. Tiles have been cracking and crumbling for years. Some have completely fallen apart. Subfloor is more than adequate, and there is no indication of deflection. Original GC finally agreed to supply labor to replace tile, but Armstrong rep says failure was do to low moisture in building. Sounds implausible to me. Tile warranty is only 5 years.
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Old 01-21-2012, 05:50 PM   #17
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


I'm an armstrong certified installer, the reason I say this ,I'm supposed to be pushing brand only. For VCT I have to say Armstrong is garbage, Azrock is a perfect product. It last longer, it's perfectly rectified, and its hardness is amazing, stands up to heavy traffic better than armstrong. Stick with that.
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Old 01-22-2012, 04:38 PM   #18
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by dledge View Post
One of my clients has Armstrong Imperial Texture Standard Excelon VCT in a busy doctor's office. Building was built in 2003. Tiles have been cracking and crumbling for years. Some have completely fallen apart. Subfloor is more than adequate, and there is no indication of deflection. Original GC finally agreed to supply labor to replace tile, but Armstrong rep says failure was do to low moisture in building. Sounds implausible to me. Tile warranty is only 5 years.
********************************
This isn't relevant to a brand comparison.

I've seen just about everything over the years starting in 1978 frequently being a "trouble shooter" for commercial flooring shops. Sometimes I'm looking at jobs others did that customers want repaired. Sometimes our shop did the work recently or 10-20 year prior.

Moisture is by far the #1 problem I come across. When customers, GCs, inspectors and tech reps call out "installer error" usually what they mean is that the installation was done out of compliance with their specific TOLERANCE levels for moisture and alkalinity in the slab.

I don't have any experience that compares Azrock to Armstrong as far as holding up JUST to moisture. I see both brands commonly failing if moisture isn't addressed prior to installation. Anyway, in my experience moisture is the conduit for alkaline salts which are the actual agent of destruction to the underlayment, adhesive and flooring.

For the record.....and a bit of COMMON SENSE......installers and installation companies ALWAYS would prefer to sell and install the premium protection against moisture and related effects. It's primarily MIDDLE MEN and customers who undermine this protection to save a buck.

How that impacts the interests (read: liability) of the installer has mostly to do with how well he knows how to write a contract waiver and what level of legal council he can afford to structure those contracts on the front end and then litigate on the back end.

No one ever said it was going to be easy to compete in the Big Leagues.

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Old 01-22-2012, 08:02 PM   #19
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


Quote:
Originally Posted by Floormasta78 View Post
I'm an armstrong certified installer, the reason I say this ,I'm supposed to be pushing brand only. For VCT I have to say Armstrong is garbage, Azrock is a perfect product. It last longer, it's perfectly rectified, and its hardness is amazing, stands up to heavy traffic better than armstrong. Stick with that.
****************
I don't believe I can recall ever hearing another installer praise the quality of Azrock compared to Armstrong.

It was at least 10 years ago when I was doing the Walmarts. Around that time we did many, many supermarkets and retail stores with both Azrock and Armstrong. The specs would always call out Armstrong "or equivalent" and where our shop could sway the architect toward the Azrock color scheme it would increase our profit margin. I was always able to make the product work. It's just not as square and of inconsistent size, color and marbleization COMPARED to Armstrong. So to me it added very slightly to labor costs. We had to cull out a lot of tiles as we worked and then go burn a few out that got past but stood out from a standing position.

It's possible they've improved their dimensional stability issues, color consistency........whatnot.

I may have told this story before. Pardon me if so but my boss was responding to my complaints about Azrock quality. He was insisting that they had spent umpteen millions dollars building a new manufacturing facility. I thought for a minute. I asked him who was the WORST installer he ever worked with. He instantly replied Clyde. I knew Clyde. I worked with Clyde and he worked with Clyde back in the day.

So I asked him, "If Clyde went out and spent $50K on new carpet tools would you want him installing for you?"

I rest my case.
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Old 01-23-2012, 12:23 PM   #20
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Re: Tarkett Vs Armstrong VCT Tile


I found that AZROCK has a rougher edge than Armstrong and makes the layout runnoff.

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