My bread and butter for all these years has been the big box stores. I have encountered many staircases on these jobs and have great success in producing beautiful staircases with prefinished hardwood flooring. However, I have had few chances to work on projects involving solid treads.
This week I will be starting on the job pictured below. This is my plan:
The treads and risers are to match the hickory flooring (not shown) in the main room adjacent to this foyer. I plan to make rosin paper templates with the aid of a compass. These I will transfer to MDF templates, accounting for the overhang. After checking these on-site, I will manufacture the treads at the shop.
Esteemed members, I am calling upon your experience to shed light on the holes in my plan. How much time should it take. What would you charge for this project (6 curved/open, 6 pie, 6 box)? The bottom step is 8 feet at its longest point. Also, is anyone familiar with the characeristics of hickory?
Thank you in advance for your feedback. I am excited to get this assignment and am confident I will be successful. Still, I am not a Master and I am always open to suggestions.
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My bread and butter for all these years has been the big box stores. I have encountered many staircases on these jobs and have great success in producing beautiful staircases with prefinished hardwood flooring. However, I have had few chances to work on projects involving solid treads.
This week I will be starting on the job pictured below. This is my plan:
The treads and risers are to match the hickory flooring (not shown) in the main room adjacent to this foyer. I plan to make rosin paper templates with the aid of a compass. These I will transfer to MDF templates, accounting for the overhang. After checking these on-site, I will manufacture the treads at the shop.
Esteemed members, I am calling upon your experience to shed light on the holes in my plan. How much time should it take. What would you charge for this project (6 curved/open, 6 pie, 6 box)? The bottom step is 8 feet at its longest point. Also, is anyone familiar with the characeristics of hickory?
Thank you in advance for your feedback. I am excited to get this assignment and am confident I will be successful. Still, I am not a Master and I am always open to suggestions.
Hehehehe!!!
I will tell you, the bottom step alone, is going to run you almost $1000, all said and done.
Trade:
LI,NY designer, new homes, renovation work, concre
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 4,153
Fun looking job, the risers, whats your plan? maybe 3 layers of 1/4'' hickory ply. also need to finish exposed side of riser....just looked at it again, your not bending 1/4'' around that first step, for that piece only you need a skin 1/16'' veneer.
Trade:
LI,NY designer, new homes, renovation work, concre
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Long Island, NY
Posts: 4,153
not much room for trim around that opening after the first step riser is installed, that floor tile is NOCE TRAVERTINE, I THINK, i always liked that stone....
The riser is a little rough on that bottom step. I need to build it out a little for smoothness. I saw something recently called 'KerfCore' (?) that looked like a good solution. It is simply pre-kerfed risers in various thicknesses. I will go to the supplier tomorrow and price all of the wood. I really appreciate your insight, Gene. Thanks for taking the time.
i would be charging in the region of 15 to 20k to supply and install, finsh those stairs,
Thanks for looking, mrghm.
15k? 20k?? I will be posting pictures by next week of the finished steps. I can not wait to see where the group rates my installation.
Thanks for looking, everybody. This is the perhaps the most demanding project I have undertaken. I welcome feedback from the community.
These are not yet installed. I was simply checking the fit. The 2nd step is bare, but the other two have a single coat of polyurethane (Dura Seal, Satin) each. I plan to do 2 coats before they are installed and a final coat after.
Last edited by dokuhaku; 10-12-2008 at 02:15 AM.
Reason: for clarity
Returns are radiused. That feature, though minor, is probably my favorite detail. Neither the GC nor the homeowner mentioned it while looking at the steps. I think it would have been all they could talk about if I had made them straight.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrWright
...What's your plan for the skirts?...
The GC said he had a plan for the skirt after I was finished. Honestly, I find the steps challenging enough. On the curved wall, the skirt would have been completely out of my league. Hopefully I will get the chance to work with someone on a similar situation one day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrWright
...Will there be a cove mold under the noses of the treads?...
The plan is to have a narrow trim run vertically, capping the end of each open riser. Aside from that, I do not plan to install a cove on the underside of the treads. What is your opinion?
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrWright
...I would use 3/8" bending ply for the starting riser, and then face it in place with a paper backed veneer...
All along I have been imagining a 1/4" ply with a hickory veneer. Because I have not encountered such curved risers before, I do not yet know how it will play out.
Can you elaborate on 'paper-backed veneer'? In my mind I imagined installing the 1/4" thick risers, then creating a paper pattern (?) for the veneer which would be installed with contact cement. What do you think?
Returns are radiused. That feature, though minor, is probably my favorite detail. Neither the GC nor the homeowner mentioned it while looking at the steps. I think it would have been all they could talk about if I had made them straight.
That shows great attention to detail on your part.
The GC said he had a plan for the skirt after I was finished. Honestly, I find the steps challenging enough. On the curved wall, the skirt would have been completely out of my league. Hopefully I will get the chance to work with someone on a similar situation one day.
I'd be very curious to hear what his idea is. The inside skirt should be on the wall before you install the treads and risers. The outside skirt, if solid, would be mitered to meet the riser. My suspicion is they will cheap out and try to install some kind of shoe mold against the wall.
The plan is to have a narrow trim run vertically, capping the end of each open riser. Aside from that, I do not plan to install a cove on the underside of the treads. What is your opinion?
You're spending a lot of time and attention to detail, it seems a shame to cut corners at the end.
All along I have been imagining a 1/4" ply with a hickory veneer. Because I have not encountered such curved risers before, I do not yet know how it will play out.
Can you elaborate on 'paper-backed veneer'? In my mind I imagined installing the 1/4" thick risers, then creating a paper pattern (?) for the veneer which would be installed with contact cement. What do you think?
1/4" hickory ply will not turn the radius of your starting riser very well. You can get it to turn but where it meets the wall at the open end it will want to flatten out.
An easier solution: one layer of 3/8" bending plywood, with a paperbacked veneer glued to create the finished surface.
You can purchase paper-backed veneers in most domestic hardwood species. The actual wood itself is a bit thinner than raw veneer but it's less labor intensive to work with and is especially good for radius applications such as your starting riser.
Bending plywood comes in 4x8 sheets in several thicknesses. Typical plywood laminations have the wood grain of each layer alternated for strength and stability. Bending ply is made with the grain of each lamination running the same way--so it will easily turn a radius.
Do a google search for paper backed veneer and you'll find a lot of good information on the sizes available and the best adhesives to use.
Location: Beech Grove, Indiana, Birthplace of the "King of Cool"
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They sure are pretty.
I can't claim to be an expert, since the
bottom riser especially is far more radical
than anything I have done, but steamed
and bent solid wood is what seems right to me.
Hickory is a good steaming wood, but the most
I've done is for rocking chair parts.
Veneers on stair risers will look good, but
how long will it last?
Conversely, one could repair it over time.
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(Sorry....it seems there really are dumb questions)
"The plan is to have a narrow trim run vertically, capping the end of each open riser. Aside from that, I do not plan to install a cove on the underside of the treads. What is your opinion?" -Dokuhaku
You're spending a lot of time and attention to detail, it seems a shame to cut corners at the end..
You are correct. I am taking my time to make this look sweet and I do not intend to cut corners. I didn't think the cove would be necessary. Honestly, it always looks to me like the cove is hiding a gap between the tread and the riser.
So, the absence of the cove would make it look unfinished to you? huh... I guess I will rethink it. Thank you for taking the time to share your thoughts. This forum is really helpful.
...steamed and bent solid wood is what seems right to me...
That is intriguing. I have never steamed wood, though I certainly get the idea. I suppose there would need to be a template (jig?) made for the wood to form to.
Hah! I just visualized installing a 12' long, steaming plank, drooping and dripping like a wood noodle. (A woodle? )
That would turn a few heads.
20k?? I will be posting pictures by next week of the finished steps. I can not wait to see where the group rates my installation.
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