hardwood----hard problems - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

jerrykauf · 10-19-2007, 02:52 PM

I`ve got a home built on a slab with hardwood flooring installed (bruce hardwood flooring) glued down with Bruce Equalizer Adhesive, moisture cured urethane, It`s the armstrong S-135 vap. arrest. anyway I`ve got a few areas where the flooring has separated from the slab, the adhesive stuck to the flooring, and at one time was glued to the slab, however over a period of about 6-months I have about4 or5 areas where it has separated, one of the areas is very large about 3-foot in diameter. there are no water leaks, and after pulling a piece of the flooring up I noticed a greasy feeling on the slab and the underside of the flooring, also the adhesive is soft enough to make a mark with my fingernail. Is there anyone out there who has experienced this type of situation before, or knows of a way to solve this problem so we can repair the areas that need repaired?

Thanks a bunch,
Jerry

Floordude · 10-19-2007, 04:04 PM

Is the Bruce solid wood(Natural Reflections) or engineered(they have many)

How was the concrete tested and prepped, before the gluedown installation was started??

jerrykauf · 10-20-2007, 09:16 AM

I believe the flooring is solid wood, and as far as the prep I believe the flooring installer just swept the slab and installed.

neolitic · 10-20-2007, 09:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerrykauf

I believe the flooring is solid wood, and as far as the prep I believe the flooring installer just swept the slab and installed.

Installer wuz probaly a f***ing Boilermaker

Really, was the slab maybe "green", new house?

**Teetorbilt** · 10-20-2007, 11:14 AM

Another case made for using a shopvac and two coats of a penetrating concrete sealer.

Rich Turley · 10-20-2007, 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerrykauf

I believe the flooring is solid wood, and as far as the prep I believe the flooring installer just swept the slab and installed.

Man, I'm not sure, but I don't think solid wood can go directly to slab, for sure not in a basement. Engineered can glue onto slab, but solid needs a sleeper system.

What does Bruce have to say?

Rich

sunshinefloor · 10-20-2007, 11:33 AM

were do you live in the south or up north ?

Floordude · 10-20-2007, 11:53 AM

Gluing a solid over concrete, is risky business. There are

Unless you used Stauf 960 adhesive, a separate moisture barrier like Dependables VaporSeal, or even Bostik's System, or Mapei's new urethane membrane system.

Is this flooring cupped(looks like a washboard)??
Or just losing bond with the substrate?
If you laid an 8 foot straight edge over these unbonded areas, will the straight edge sit flat??

Tmrrptr · 10-20-2007, 12:01 PM

Is there OIL on the slab?
Someone could have poured 30wt on it using a whirlybird????
...or someone's air compressor could have leaked???
I've seen both, and more...
r

jerrykauf · 10-21-2007, 06:44 PM

many hardwood floors have been installed without first sealing the slab, I myself have installed hardwood flooring without concrete sealer, so I know that is not the problem, as I had said before there seemed to be an oily residue on this one large area that had released from the slab, I just wanted to see if anyone else on this great big earth has ever seen or heard of this, and possably know of a remedy.

jerrykauf · 10-21-2007, 06:47 PM

Yes this is a new home, thats why I have asked this question concerning this house (because I do warranty repairs for homebuilders) so now back to the question............

jerrykauf · 10-21-2007, 06:51 PM

Yes this can go on a slab, It`s been done in almost evwery home I`ve been in, I just have never seen this sort of thing happen before, I am still waiting for a reply from the hardwood & adhesive company, I was just hoping someone out there has seen this problem before, and could give me some advise as how to get it fixed, especially with the knowledge that it will not happen again.

jerrykauf · 10-21-2007, 06:52 PM

This home is located in West Lafayette Indiana Arber Chase subdivision, why?

jerrykauf · 10-21-2007, 06:57 PM

This flooring is installed this way all the time, and is designed for this type of application. It has been installed in every home I have been in. That is why I am asking about this problem on this web site, because I have never seen anything like this happen before.
There is just one large area that the bonding agent has released from the concrete slab, the area is about 2 feet in diameter. the glue is still stuck to the flooring but has released from the slab. We need to know why so we can get this fixed without the fear of it happening again.

jerrykauf · 10-21-2007, 07:00 PM

I don`t know, other then there is an oily feling on the underside of some of the flooring, and that is the way I am leaning, as far as the bonding agent releasing, what I need to knoe is where did the oil come from. before the house was sold the floor was fine, then slowly started coming up during the summer.

747 · 10-21-2007, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerrykauf

This home is located in West Lafayette Indiana Arber Chase subdivision, why?

How far is that from purdue. I'm just curious because its been a while since i've been to lafayette. I go 41 south and then get on 52 at kentland. That old school there.

Floordude · 10-21-2007, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jerrykauf

I don`t know, other then there is an oily feling on the underside of some of the flooring, and that is the way I am leaning, as far as the bonding agent releasing, what I need to knoe is where did the oil come from. before the house was sold the floor was fine, then slowly started coming up during the summer.

If you laid an 8 foot straight edge over these unbonded areas, will the straight edge sit flat??

There very well could have been a contaminate. If the glue came clean off the concrete, you may be right. Then gravity takes over and the hollow spot is never noticed, unless hard sole shoes are walked across it.

Being it happened during the summer, and wood doing what wood does, swelling will do it too, in the form a a slight buckle. More so if this is a plank floor and not a strip floor.

Jerry T · 10-22-2007, 04:11 AM

Ask if there were any Kerosene space heaters in use during construction. Those things will contaminate the substrate with the fallout..... and especially if some kerosene got spilled.