acid stain - Contractor Talk - Professional Construction and Remodeling Forum

King of Crown · 03-05-2006, 11:55 PM

How come there arent any threads about acid staining cement, do you guys do this kind of thing? i know it is getting big in Florida, and it is huge in the high end houses here in az. i am thinking about funding a business that does that, if you guys know anything about the stuff it would help. thanks

ee3 · 03-06-2006, 10:25 AM

There are Co. that do this type of work.Most have approved installers.
Afew of them are Increte,Ardex,Bomanite.

King of Crown · 03-06-2006, 11:40 PM

thanks for your help.

Bud Cline · 03-07-2006, 02:54 PM

Look up Gaye Goodman for all the information you could ever want or need. Gaye is an artist in New mexico that is a pioneer in acid staining concrete.
Her website has a forum such as this with the exception that they know what they are talking about over there. She also offers schooling and videos on the subject.

King of Crown · 03-07-2006, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bud Cline

Look up Gaye Goodman for all the information you could ever want or need. Gaye is an artist in New mexico that is a pioneer in acid staining concrete.
Her website has a forum such as this with the exception that they know what they are talking about over there. She also offers schooling and videos on the subject.

You are the Man! just what I was looking for, thanks

Patty · 03-10-2006, 12:49 AM

Hey King, I had all new winding concrete walkways poured around my house and also had a new patio and front steps/porch done, as well. The patio out back and the front porch and steps were stamped and acid-stained.

The company that did it is owned by a good friend of mine. His firm specializes in concrete, asphalt and landscaping. They do a tremendous amount of commercial, as well as residential, work.

The reason I am posting a response to you is NOT to give any technical or procedural advice on the process but to let you consider the big picture, especially since you might be investing money in this new venture.
Is the business, you are thinking of funding, as full-service as the one I mentioned? Is it an existing business right now or a new start-up?

I happen to know that my friend actually first saw the acid-stained process a few years ago at the Annual Concrete Convention in Las Vegas. It piqued his interest and he added the "upgrade process" to his services list. But, I think he's got the cat's meow going for himself due to the fact that he can offer a homeowner a 'one-stop' shopping venue when it comes to outdoor home improvement. In example, I had him put in all my landscaping, concrete, poured, stamped & acid-stained AND retaining walls!!!

My point here is to accentuate that the acid-staining is not an entire business in itself. Now, I suppose you could market it a certain way and succeed. However, I think the safer bet is to have acid-etching/staining as an "add-on" feature to the concrete biz...not as the sole product line. And, all the better if you also do landscaping and can become a one-stop shop for the consumer. It is a user-friendly concept.

Just my 2 cents worth!

Does this make any sense? It's getting late.

P.S. I can tell you that the product does need HEAT to cure properly, so summertime is your friend...but cold weather won't cure the process properly.

King of Crown · 03-10-2006, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patty

Hey King, I had all new winding concrete walkways poured around my house and also had a new patio and front steps/porch done, as well. The patio out back and the front porch and steps were stamped and acid-stained.

The company that did it is owned by a good friend of mine. His firm specializes in concrete, asphalt and landscaping. They do a tremendous amount of commercial, as well as residential, work.

The reason I am posting a response to you is NOT to give any technical or procedural advice on the process but to let you consider the big picture, especially since you might be investing money in this new venture.
Is the business, you are thinking of funding, as full-service as the one I mentioned? Is it an existing business right now or a new start-up?

I happen to know that my friend actually first saw the acid-stained process a few years ago at the Annual Concrete Convention in Las Vegas. It piqued his interest and he added the "upgrade process" to his services list. But, I think he's got the cat's meow going for himself due to the fact that he can offer a homeowner a 'one-stop' shopping venue when it comes to outdoor home improvement. In example, I had him put in all my landscaping, concrete, poured, stamped & acid-stained AND retaining walls!!!

My point here is to accentuate that the acid-staining is not an entire business in itself. Now, I suppose you could market it a certain way and succeed. However, I think the safer bet is to have acid-etching/staining as an "add-on" feature to the concrete biz...not as the sole product line. And, all the better if you also do landscaping and can become a one-stop shop for the consumer. It is a user-friendly concept.

Just my 2 cents worth!

Does this make any sense? It's getting late.

P.S. I can tell you that the product does need HEAT to cure properly, so summertime is your friend...but cold weather won't cure the process properly.

Yeah, we're a different market down here. 90% of the custom homes down here have some sort of acid stain, or epoxy, and ,unless its a comercial job, the cement company doesnt mess with it as the cement needs to be cured for 28 days, which is to long to wait or call back on. Everything down here is blow and go. Then there is the track home market, who are trying to pull out equity and do the custom home look. This of course the cement company doesnt want to mess with because there is no cement being poured. As for the weather, The cold weather might help a little here, the longer the acid stands on cement, the darker the colors are.

Patty · 03-10-2006, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by King of Crown

Yeah, we're a different market down here. 90% of the custom homes down here have some sort of acid stain, or epoxy, and ,unless its a comercial job, the cement company doesnt mess with it as the cement needs to be cured for 28 days, which is to long to wait or call back on. Everything down here is blow and go. Then there is the track home market, who are trying to pull out equity and do the custom home look. This of course the cement company doesnt want to mess with because there is no cement being poured. As for the weather, The cold weather might help a little here, the longer the acid stands on cement, the darker the colors are.

I find your post to be interesting, King. Your market certainly IS different than it is in Chitown. Some of the companies doing concrete have also jumped on the acid-staining band-wagon, and the delay of time for the curing process doesn't seem to bother them. They just go back at the right time and finish the process.

Well, if that's the case out in your area, it sounds like you might have a real market for this type of business. I can tell you what my friend (concrete guy) did to create a "showroom" for the public. It also was a great learn-as-you-go practice for all of his employees. This is what he did, and it turned out beautifully. He was remodeling his office, inside & out. When it came to the outside sidewalks and the inside flooring, he had his guys pour concrete, and each segment of the concrete has various stamping and/or acid-staining choices for the homeowner to see. He utilized various colors and color combinations so the HO could acctually see the final outcome.

Think about it, in terms of marketing & sales. (This is beautiful!

)You bring the client TO YOUR LOCATION. They not only get to see the MOST impressive sampling of finished work, but they are a captive audience....real close to your desk....and a contract!

You can easily close a deal this way. No hemming and hawwing on issues like, "But what will it REALLY look like?" or "Do the colors vary once the process is cured?" It's a beautiful way to wrap a deal, King.

Let me ask you? Have you given any consideration to doing something like this at your place of business? It's really a good way to go because when you start mixing/combining colors, people get very scared

or reluctant to make a decision if they can't "see" what the final outcome will be.

Food 4 Thought!

King of Crown · 03-10-2006, 12:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patty

I find your post to be interesting, King. Your market certainly IS different than it is in Chitown. Some of the companies doing concrete have also jumped on the acid-staining band-wagon, and the delay of time for the curing process doesn't seem to bother them. They just go back at the right time and finish the process.

Well, if that's the case out in your area, it sounds like you might have a real market for this type of business. I can tell you what my friend (concrete guy) did to create a "showroom" for the public. It also was a great learn-as-you-go practice for all of his employees. This is what he did, and it turned out beautifully. He was remodeling his office, inside & out. When it came to the outside sidewalks and the inside flooring, he had his guys pour concrete, and each segment of the concrete has various stamping and/or acid-staining choices for the homeowner to see. He utilized various colors and color combinations so the HO could acctually see the final outcome.

Think about it, in terms of marketing & sales. (This is beautiful!

)You bring the client TO YOUR LOCATION. They not only get to see the MOST impressive sampling of finished work, but they are a captive audience....real close to your desk....and a contract!

You can easily close a deal this way. No hemming and hawwing on issues like, "But what will it REALLY look like?" or "Do the colors vary once the process is cured?" It's a beautiful way to wrap a deal, King.

Let me ask you? Have you given any consideration to doing something like this at your place of business? It's really a good way to go because when you start mixing/combining colors, people get very scared

or reluctant to make a decision if they can't "see" what the final outcome will be.

Food 4 Thought!

That is a good point, and I have heard that is a big concern, because the acid goes on one color, but is a completely different color when all is said and done. unfortunately, Im in s second story suite. no cement floor.

Patty · 03-10-2006, 12:45 PM

Ok, 2nd floor throws a monkey-wrench into things.

BUT, you probably could pour small-sized samples, say..., the size of a cookie sheet,

(bear with me here, I'm a girl....

) and they would serve the purpose, as far as showing a "finished product". I know, firsthandedly, that seeing the finished product, especially when it comes to the outcome of a custom-blended color, put my mind to ease. Although, I was a bonafide buyer already, I still felt precarious about choosing my color blends until I saw what it looked like finished.
And, working off of the manufacturer's paper palette was not good enough for me. Just a thought, here.

Bud Cline · 03-12-2006, 04:09 PM

It is impossible to create accurate samples of acid stained concrete. Unfortunately the process doesn't work like that. No gaurantees of outcome can be made when acid staining concrete. The results of each and every attempt are dependent upon the site conditions of the particular location.

No two concrete installations are the same and everything you can think of can have an effect on the outcome of acid staining. The lot of portland used at the time, the aggregate used in a batch, the atmospheric conditions of the day, the type of finish on the surface, the manner and tools used to create the finish of the surface, the exposure to sunlight and elements, contamination, existing stains and abraisions, all have an effect on the outcome of the staining process.

It is possible to create a sampling of different shades and hues but there is no way to predict what will actually happen as an end result at any given location without actually doing a sample application at that location. And even then, the overall perception and results could vary from the sample.

Tscarborough · 03-12-2006, 05:26 PM

Yep, you can only make samples of the basic hues available. Any type of small wet-poured item will work. We use splash blocks stained all over and sealed on half to give an idea of what is possible with each of the different colors available, but the only sure way is do do an on-site sample.

Zack · 08-08-2006, 06:43 PM

There are many companies that produce acid stians. Some work good and some not so good. Some acid stains that I have used are The stamp store , Bomanite, And H&C. Remember every concrete is different. You must learn what makes it work and what doesn't. The Concrete Network is a great website to check out. Hope everything works out.